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| Snow [message #92995] |
Sat, 24 November 2007 09:26  |
Neil
Messages: 1645
Registered: April 2006
|
Senior Member |
|
|
TAKE 1 MILLION SPERM TO FERTILIZE ONE EGG?
>>> (they don't stop to ask directions)
>>>
>>> 4. WHY DO MEN SNORE WHEN THEY LIE ON THEIR BACKS?
>>> (because their balls fall over their butt-hole and they vapor
>>> lock)
>>>
>>> 5. WHY WERE MEN GIVEN LARGER BRAINS THAN DOGS?
>>> (so they won't hump women's legs at cocktails parties)
>>>
>>> 6. WHY DID GOD MAKE MEN BEFORE WOMEN?
>>> (you need a rough draft before you make a final copy)
>>>
>>> 7. HOW MANY MEN DOES IT TAKE TO PUT A TOILET SEAT DOWN?
>>> (don't know.....it never happened)
>>>
>>> And the personal favorite:
>>>
>>> 8. WHY DID GOD PUT MEN ON EARTH?
>>> (because a vibrator can't mow the lawn)
>>> __________________________________________________________
>>> One day my housework-challenged husband decided to wash his Sweat-shirt
>>> Seconds after he stepped into the laundry room, he shouted to me, 'What
>>> setting do I use on the washing machine?'
>>>
>>> 'It depends,' I replied. 'What does it say on your shirt?'
>>>
>>> He yelled back, ' University of Oklahoma ..'
>>>
>>> And they say blondes are dumb...
>>>
>>> _____________________________________________________
>>> A couple is lying in bed. The man says, 'I am going to make you the
>>> happiest
>>> woman in the world.'
>>>
>>> The woman replies, 'I'll miss you...
>>
>>Smarter? Naaa. Loonier maybe. If you were loonier you would have thought
of that.
S
"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:2mamo3hjje0huv008c9bbq55efk88mc94r@4ax.com...
> and if i were smarter i would have thought of that...
>
> On Sun, 13 Jan 2008 03:16:51 -0800, "Sarah" <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com>
> wrote:
>
>>"Ignoransk is blisk" - Popeye
>>
>>S
>>
>>"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>news:32qjo3tacag3k1niba4n0sdgo18aafjb5v@4ax.com...
>>> but they're happy...afterall ignorance is bliss.
>>>
>>> On 13 Jan 2008 14:09:17 +1000, "Deej" <noway@jose.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>>>>>You are spot on. Our educational system started to decline in the late
>>>>>'60s and has never recovered
>>>>>
>>>>>In analyzing a changing trend in a statistic, such as the decline in
>>>>>the
>>>>
>>>>>quality of the US school system, what you must do is look just BEFORE
>>>>>the change occurred to find what caused it. What changed in the US
>>>>>school system that has caused the drastic reduction in results?
>>>>>
>>>>>Discuss please...
>>>>
>>>>Taking the emphasis off competition, pass/ fail grading and passing
>>>>students
>>>>
>>>>along without them being able to accomplish the coursework.
>>>
>>
>Sarah, It's hard to confront evil. Sometimes evil people smile and laugh
and seem like,they are your friend. But truly evil actions are not done
by accident. Can you think of any word other than "evil" for drugging 8
million helpless and innocent children with a harmful and very powerful
narcotic? It is NO ACCIDENT and it is VERY EVIL.
Confront it.
Sarah wrote:
> Now, settle down, Bill . . . don't go all Tom Cruise on us. "Battlefield
> Earth" was just a book and a movie . . . the psych-iatrists/ologists are not
> evil aliens from another galaxy . . . or ARE they? (dunt dunt duuunnnnn . .
> . ) Psychs . . . Psychlos . . . hmmm.
>
> I admire that Scientology usually demands specifics and personal
> observation, but when it comes to psychiatry, it's all broad generalities.
> I know a fair number of psychs through my job, and if there's an evil
> conspiracy to ruin humanity, I think someone forgot to clue them in. Now,
> the pharmaceutical companies . . . that's another story.
>
> But thanks for the nice compliment. I should tell you, though, that I'm not
> particularly young, and the fact that I can count spilled toothpicks at a
> glance doesn't make me bright.
>
> I'm an excellent driver.
>
> S
>
>
> "Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message news:478a535f$1@linux...
>> Well done, class! Your answers are all correct, but as usual our bright
>> young lady is most astute. In the '60s psychiatry started a campaign to
>> influence the schools and school systems and the teaching colleges in a
>> big way.
>>
>> In the '50s at an annual convention, the head of American Psychiatric
>> Association publicly declared their new goal of creating a "Value Neutral
>> Society". Their aim was to blur and eradicate the distinction between
>> right and wrong.
>>
>> They knew that the sure way to change society was by influencing the
>> children. Psychiatrists have gradually introduced to our schools the mass
>> drugging of children and even infants (approximately 8 million on Ritalin
>> type drugs), Outcome Based Education (doesn't matter how much or how well
>> children learn, just that they felt good about it) and the rest of their
>> psuchobabble notions of how people should think and behave.
>>
>> Who was the most influential proponent of the "drug culture"? Not
>> coincidentally, a psychologist and college professor, Dr. Timothy Leary.
>>
>> When you hear someone derided for being "judgmental", that is the
>> influence of psychiatric double speak. Smart, ethical people used to be
>> regarded as showing "good judgment", but now that positive attribute of
>> being able to rightly judge people and situations has been slyly skewed
>> into a bad thing. I'm sure you have noticed other examples of how
>> illogical psychiatric concepts have replaced good reasoning.
>>
>> When you look around our society and see the delineation between right and
>> wrong, logical and illogical, smart and stupid being blurred it is no
>> accident. Look to the only group who has for over 50 years had that as
>> their stated aim: psychiatry and psychology.
>>
>> We can fix our schools but we must first recognize the source of the
>> problem and erase its influence or it will only get worse. Our children
>> are our responsibility.
>>
>>
>> rick wrote:
>>> yup, a bunch of egotistical numbnuts. it astounds me the level of non
>>> educated college graduates we're churning out...with pride.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, 13 Jan 2008 01:29:11 -0800, "Sarah" <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I think you got it, Don. Psychologists pretending to know something
>>>> decided that discipline and competion were harmful to children's mental
>>>> health.
>>>>
>>>> S
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:4789a15e$1@linux...
>>>>> Self esteem replaced achievement.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>
>Kids have little choice when adults conspire to do EVIL. For example, I
was subjected to the EVILS of orthodontics! Hauled into a small room
against my will and tortured with small instruments wielded by sadists.
Cleverly painful devices were attached to my teeth and wires were
tightened periodically to keep my teeth in line. Four perfectly good
teeth were yanked out during the multi-year program of abuse. Drugs were
used, but never enough. Even after all that, my teeth never admitted
anything, not even name, rank or serial number.
Granted, now I have straight teeth, but still!
I'm pretty sure the evils of the world can be rightly blamed on
orthodontists. Millions of kids were subjected to this, and also some
adults. It is NO ACCIDENT and VERY EVIL. :^)
Meanwhile I have observed a few psychologists and psychiatrists helping
people straighten out their lives. Not always successfully, there is
much yet to learn. Just as we will someday find better ways to
straighten teeth. But I have seen good things happen with the help of
caring people who seem to be trying to help as best they know how. Some
prescribing drugs, (our knowledge of brain chemistry and psych drugs
still seems to be at a fairly experimental stage, I'll give you that),
and some not.
Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com
Bill L wrote:
> Sarah, It's hard to confront evil. Sometimes evil people smile and laugh
> and seem like,they are your friend. But truly evil actions are not done
> by accident. Can you think of any word other than "evil" for drugging 8
> million helpless and innocent children with a harmful and very powerful
> narcotic? It is NO ACCIDENT and it is VERY EVIL.
>
> Confront it.
>
> Sarah wrote:
>> Now, settle down, Bill . . . don't go all Tom Cruise on us.
>> "Battlefield Earth" was just a book and a movie . . . the
>> psych-iatrists/ologists are not evil aliens from another galaxy . . .
>> or ARE they? (dunt dunt duuunnnnn . . . ) Psychs . . . Psychlos . .
>> . hmmm.
>>
>> I admire that Scientology usually demands specifics and personal
>> observation, but when it comes to psychiatry, it's all broad
>> generalities. I know a fair number of psychs through my job, and if
>> there's an evil conspiracy to ruin humanity, I think someone forgot to
>> clue them in. Now, the pharmaceutical companies . . . that's another
>> story.
>>
>> But thanks for the nice compliment. I should tell you, though, that
>> I'm not particularly young, and the fact that I can count spilled
>> toothpicks at a glance doesn't make me bright.
>>
>> I'm an excellent driver.
>>
>> S
>>
>>
>> "Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message
>> news:478a535f$1@linux...
>>> Well done, class! Your answers are all correct, but as usual our
>>> bright young lady is most astute. In the '60s psychiatry started a
>>> campaign to influence the schools and school systems and the teaching
>>> colleges in a big way.
>>>
>>> In the '50s at an annual convention, the head of American Psychiatric
>>> Association publicly declared their new goal of creating a "Value
>>> Neutral Society". Their aim was to blur and eradicate the distinction
>>> between right and wrong.
>>>
>>> They knew that the sure way to change society was by influencing the
>>> children. Psychiatrists have gradually introduced to our schools the
>>> mass drugging of children and even infants (approximately 8 million
>>> on Ritalin type drugs), Outcome Based Education (doesn't matter how
>>> much or how well children learn, just that they felt good about it)
>>> and the rest of their psuchobabble notions of how people should think
>>> and behave.
>>>
>>> Who was the most influential proponent of the "drug culture"? Not
>>> coincidentally, a psychologist and college professor, Dr. Timothy Leary.
>>>
>>> When you hear someone derided for being "judgmental", that is the
>>> influence of psychiatric double speak. Smart, ethical people used to
>>> be regarded as showing "good judgment", but now that positive
>>> attribute of being able to rightly judge people and situations has
>>> been slyly skewed into a bad thing. I'm sure you have noticed other
>>> examples of how illogical psychiatric concepts have replaced good
>>> reasoning.
>>>
>>> When you look around our society and see the delineation between
>>> right and wrong, logical and illogical, smart and stupid being
>>> blurred it is no accident. Look to the only group who has for over 50
>>> years had that as their stated aim: psychiatry and psychology.
>>>
>>> We can fix our schools but we must first recognize the source of the
>>> problem and erase its influence or it will only get worse. Our
>>> children are our responsibility.
>>>
>>>
>>> rick wrote:
>>>> yup, a bunch of egotistical numbnuts. it astounds me the level of non
>>>> educated college graduates we're churning out...with pride.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, 13 Jan 2008 01:29:11 -0800, "Sarah" <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I think you got it, Don. Psychologists pretending to know
>>>>> something decided that discipline and competion were harmful to
>>>>> children's mental health.
>>>>>
>>>>> S
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:4789a15e$1@linux...
>>>>>> Self esteem replaced achievement.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>
>>So, Don, who decides what morals are taught? And 'me' isn't a fair answer,
though I know that's what you'd prefer.
TCB
"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>>Well done, class! Your answers are all correct, but as usual our bright
>
>>young lady is most astute. In the '60s psychiatry started a campaign to
>
>> influence the schools and school systems and the teaching colleges in
>
>>a big way.
>
>There's more to it than this. Part of it is also the cult of IQ and the
>
>separation of values reasoning and virtue from cognition.
>
>It's all intelligence, it's all cognition.
>
>But because we have been told we want a values-free education and are
>foolish enough to accept the illusion of detached neutrality, we separate
>out certain functions of the mind and call them intelligence while
>dismissing others as "not intelligence" but wisdom, virtue, honor,
>decency, etc. So we end up with Teddy Roosevelt's famous comment
>coming true in our lifetimes:
>
>"To educate a man in mind and not in morals is to educate a menace to society."
>
>Today, the very idea of society, as a system of shared values and assumed
>decencies is seen as laughable by a lot of people, while "intelligence"
is
>
>treated by the quasi-educated as silicone is treated by porn stars.
>
>I don't like psychiatry much more than you do Bill (though I think there
>is a place for it in extreme cases where treatment has prevented suicides
>and murders) but it is not the source of the culture we live in. It is
a
>symptom not a cause.
>
>I am with you on drugs though. I HATE drugs. I have seen more
>lives, bands, marriages, and great minds ruined by drugs, (and some of
>them prescribed drugs), than almost any other single factor.
>
>DCEvidently not the atheists....
DC
"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>
>So, Don, who decides what morals are taught? And 'me' isn't a fair answer,
>though I know that's what you'd prefer.
>
>TCB
>
>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>
>>Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>>>Well done, class! Your answers are all correct, but as usual our bright
>>
>>>young lady is most astute. In the '60s psychiatry started a campaign to
>>
>>> influence the schools and school systems and the teaching colleges in
>>
>>>a big way.
>>
>>There's more to it than this. Part of it is also the cult of IQ and the
>>
>>separation of values reasoning and virtue from cognition.
>>
>>It's all intelligence, it's all cognition.
>>
>>But because we have been told we want a values-free education and are
>>foolish enough to accept the illusion of detached neutrality, we separate
>>out certain functions of the mind and call them intelligence while
>>dismissing others as "not intelligence" but wisdom, virtue, honor,
>>decency, etc. So we end up with Teddy Roosevelt's famous comment
>>coming true in our lifetimes:
>>
>>"To educate a man in mind and not in morals is to educate a menace to society."
>>
>>Today, the very idea of society, as a system of shared values and assumed
>>decencies is seen as laughable by a lot of people, while "intelligence"
>is
>>
>>treated by the quasi-educated as silicone is treated by porn stars.
>>
>>I don't like psychiatry much more than you do Bill (though I think there
>>is a place for it in extreme cases where treatment has prevented suicides
>>and murders) but it is not the source of the culture we live in. It is
>a
>>symptom not a cause.
>>
>>I am with you on drugs though. I HATE drugs. I have seen more
>>lives, bands, marriages, and great minds ruined by drugs, (and some of
>>them prescribed drugs), than almost any other single factor.
>>
>>DC
>Hi Greg,
I'd recommend sticking with Windows XP if you can. There are kernel functions
in XP that are missing in Windows 2000, and this could pose a problem for
you either now or as I work on a newer build of the driver.
All the best,
Mike
"Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>oh, and yes.. you will have to use the XP drivers.
>
>AA
>
>"Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
>news:478ae483$1@linux...
>> I've heard of 2 ppl that tried, one with some successes but it's been
a
>> while (over 2 or 3 years ago) and I don't recall who. I guess the worst
>> you can do it try, but I sure like XP a lot better (over 2k in general)
if
>> you have the option, and you'll be in better company if things don't go
>> well at some point and you need help.
>>
>> AA
>>
>>
>> "Gregb" <funkykeys1@verizon.net> wrote in message news:478ae017$1@linux...
>>>
>>> "Gregb" <funkykeys1@verizon.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>Is anyone using Windows 2000 successfully? If so, did you install the
xp
>>> drivers?
>>>>Thanks!
>>>
>>>
>>> Anyone?
>>
>>
>
>I have a bunch of sessions that I recorded in Paris that I want
to work on in Pro Tools LE. Is there an easy (OK- relatively)
easy way to convert the .paf-.wav, and/or the actual sessions?
Thanks! -Jim Rosenthal, Dallas, TX (past Ensoniq and EMU rep)"Kim" <hiddensounds@hotmail.com> wrote:
Kim any other suggestions
>
>
>Be aware that Kim W, Deej and myself have all had these boards fail on us...
>
>They work great... while they work. ;o)
>
>Cheers,
>Kim.
>
>"jim drago" <jamesd@prospectlk12.or.us> wrote:
>>
>>Thank you for your responses so far. I am now looking for a K8NS mobo.
Next
>>? What is a good processor with this mobo? What is a good video card, I'll
>>be using 1 HP w2007 to start maybe add one l more later. Good PS. and good
>>rack mountable case. Sorry for so many ?'s Jim
>Thanks Aaron/Mike.
I will buy another copy of XP and go from there. I just happened to have
a copy of 2000 laying around so thought I'd ask.
Greg
"Mike Audet" <mike@...> wrote:
>
>Hi Greg,
>
>I'd recommend sticking with Windows XP if you can. There are kernel functions
>in XP that are missing in Windows 2000, and this could pose a problem for
>you either now or as I work on a newer build of the driver.
>
>All the best,
>
>Mike
>
>
>"Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote:
>>oh, and yes.. you will have to use the XP drivers.
>>
>>AA
>>
>>"Aaron Allen" <know-spam@not_here.dude> wrote in message
>>news:478ae483$1@linux...
>>> I've heard of 2 ppl that tried, one with some successes but it's been
>a
>>> while (over 2 or 3 years ago) and I don't recall who. I guess the worst
>
>>> you can do it try, but I sure like XP a lot better (over 2k in general)
>if
>>> you have the option, and you'll be in better company if things don't
go
>
>>> well at some point and you need help.
>>>
>>> AA
>>>
>>>
>>> "Gregb" <funkykeys1@verizon.net> wrote in message news:478ae017$1@linux...
>>>>
>>>> "Gregb" <funkykeys1@verizon.net> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>Is anyone using Windows 2000 successfully? If so, did you install the
>xp
>>>> drivers?
>>>>>Thanks!
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Anyone?
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>Good answer, Don, and a fine defense of your argument that 'morals' and 'value
reasoning' should be part of (publicly funded, with my tax dollars) education.
TCB
"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>Evidently not the atheists....
>
>DC
>
>
>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>
>>So, Don, who decides what morals are taught? And 'me' isn't a fair answer,
>>though I know that's what you'd prefer.
>>
>>TCB
>>
>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>>>>Well done, class! Your answers are all correct, but as usual our bright
>>>
>>>>young lady is most astute. In the '60s psychiatry started a campaign
to
>>>
>>>> influence the schools and school systems and the teaching colleges
in
>>>
>>>>a big way.
>>>
>>>There's more to it than this. Part of it is also the cult of IQ and the
>>>
>>>separation of values reasoning and virtue from cognition.
>>>
>>>It's all intelligence, it's all cognition.
>>>
>>>But because we have been told we want a values-free education and are
>>>foolish enough to accept the illusion of detached neutrality, we separate
>>>out certain functions of the mind and call them intelligence while
>>>dismissing others as "not intelligence" but wisdom, virtue, honor,
>>>decency, etc. So we end up with Teddy Roosevelt's famous comment
>>>coming true in our lifetimes:
>>>
>>>"To educate a man in mind and not in morals is to educate a menace to
society."
>>>
>>>Today, the very idea of society, as a system of shared values and assumed
>>>decencies is seen as laughable by a lot of people, while "intelligence"
>>is
>>>
>>>treated by the quasi-educated as silicone is treated by porn stars.
>>>
>>>I don't like psychiatry much more than you do Bill (though I think there
>>>is a place for it in extreme cases where treatment has prevented suicides
>>>and murders) but it is not the source of the culture we live in. It is
>>a
>>>symptom not a cause.
>>>
>>>I am with you on drugs though. I HATE drugs. I have seen more
>>>lives, bands, marriages, and great minds ruined by drugs, (and some of
>>>them prescribed drugs), than almost any other single factor.
>>>
>>>DC
>>
>So, you really do have nothing to offer?
Are there no civic virtues to be taught? Or is it true that all morals
must derive from belief in absolutes?
DC
"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>
>Good answer, Don, and a fine defense of your argument that 'morals' and
'value
>reasoning' should be part of (publicly funded, with my tax dollars) education.
>
>
>TCB
>
>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>
>>Evidently not the atheists....
>>
>>DC
>>
>>
>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>So, Don, who decides what morals are taught? And 'me' isn't a fair answer,
>>>though I know that's what you'd prefer.
>>>
>>>TCB
>>>
>>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>>>>>Well done, class! Your answers are all correct, but as usual our bright
>>>>
>>>>>young lady is most astute. In the '60s psychiatry started a campaign
>to
>>>>
>>>>> influence the schools and school systems and the teaching colleges
>in
>>>>
>>>>>a big way.
>>>>
>>>>There's more to it than this. Part of it is also the cult of IQ and
the
>>>>
>>>>separation of values reasoning and virtue from cognition.
>>>>
>>>>It's all intelligence, it's all cognition.
>>>>
>>>>But because we have been told we want a values-free education and are
>>>>foolish enough to accept the illusion of detached neutrality, we separate
>>>>out certain functions of the mind and call them intelligence while
>>>>dismissing others as "not intelligence" but wisdom, virtue, honor,
>>>>decency, etc. So we end up with Teddy Roosevelt's famous comment
>>>>coming true in our lifetimes:
>>>>
>>>>"To educate a man in mind and not in morals is to educate a menace to
>society."
>>>>
>>>>Today, the very idea of society, as a system of shared values and assumed
>>>>decencies is seen as laughable by a lot of people, while "intelligence"
>>>is
>>>>
>>>>treated by the quasi-educated as silicone is treated by porn stars.
>>>>
>>>>I don't like psychiatry much more than you do Bill (though I think there
>>>>is a place for it in extreme cases where treatment has prevented suicides
>>>>and murders) but it is not the source of the culture we live in. It
is
>>>a
>>>>symptom not a cause.
>>>>
>>>>I am with you on drugs though. I HATE drugs. I have seen more
>>>>lives, bands, marriages, and great minds ruined by drugs, (and some of
>>>>them prescribed drugs), than almost any other single factor.
>>>>
>>>>DC
>>>
>>
>Hey Bill,
I realize you have strong personal opinions, or more accurately strong visceral
reactions to the psychiatric profession. I happen to agree that brain meds
are vastly over prescribed. However, my father is a (retired) counseling
psychology Ph.D. and my mother is a (ditto) retired high school counselor.
Trust me, there is no vast conspiracy in the head shrinking community to
get everyone medicated. The _is_ an easily understood and contemptible conspiracy
by drug companies to get their drugs prescribed so they make money, but the
idea that there is some back room cabal of shrinks trying to get us all on
Zoloft? It just ain't so.
In addition, there are a number of situations where it is stone cold necessary
to have people highly skilled and trained to deal with personality disorders.
For example, one of my good friends and fave golfing buddy (he's a freaking
four handicap, which is incredibly annoying) makes a fair bit of his living
doing assessments of sex offenders who are up for parole or who have served
their sentence. Sex offenders are notoriously recidivist criminals but (so
far) the law doesn't allow them to be held forever. My friend's job is to
assess those up for parole to make his best judgment about which prisoners
are unlikely to be a danger to others if released, and also to create programs
of therapy in the hope that those who have served their full sentence (or
are paroled) can be prevented from committing further crimes. It agonizing,
difficult work, and in addition to doing absolutely the best job he can (sometimes
involving drug therapies) he has a wonderful family and two adorable bloodhounds.
To paint him, and the many thousands of other well meaning head shrinkers,
with a single brush as essentially evil scientists is just unfair.
Again, this is obviously a personal thing for you, and that's fine, but keep
the rhetoric respectful of the people who do the best job they can.
TCB
Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>Well done, class! Your answers are all correct, but as usual our bright
>young lady is most astute. In the '60s psychiatry started a campaign to
> influence the schools and school systems and the teaching colleges in
>a big way.
>
>In the '50s at an annual convention, the head of American Psychiatric
>Association publicly declared their new goal of creating a "Value
>Neutral Society". Their aim was to blur and eradicate the distinction
>between right and wrong.
>
>They knew that the sure way to change society was by influencing the
>children. Psychiatrists have gradually introduced to our schools the
>mass drugging of children and even infants (approximately 8 million on
>Ritalin type drugs), Outcome Based Education (doesn't matter how much or
>how well children learn, just that they felt good about it) and the rest
>of their psuchobabble notions of how people should think and behave.
>
>Who was the most influential proponent of the "drug culture"? Not
>coincidentally, a psychologist and college professor, Dr. Timothy Leary.
>
>When you hear someone derided for being "judgmental", that is the
>influence of psychiatric double speak. Smart, ethical people used to be
>regarded as showing "good judgment", but now that positive attribute of
>being able to rightly judge people and situations has been slyly skewed
>into a bad thing. I'm sure you have noticed other examples of how
>illogical psychiatric concepts have replaced good reasoning.
>
>When you look around our society and see the delineation between right
>and wrong, logical and illogical, smart and stupid being blurred it is
>no accident. Look to the only group who has for over 50 years had that
>as their stated aim: psychiatry and psychology.
>
>We can fix our schools but we must first recognize the source of the
>problem and erase its influence or it will only get worse. Our children
>are our responsibility.
>
>
>rick wrote:
>> yup, a bunch of egotistical numbnuts. it astounds me the level of non
>> educated college graduates we're churning out...with pride.
>>
>>
>> On Sun, 13 Jan 2008 01:29:11 -0800, "Sarah" <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I think you got it, Don. Psychologists pretending to know something
decided
>>> that discipline and competion were harmful to children's mental health.
>>>
>>> S
>>>
>>>
>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:4789a15e$1@linux...
>>>> Self esteem replaced achievement.
>>>>
>>>>
>>I have plenty of ideas about what should be taught, Don, but I didn't make
the 'morals are part of cognition and have to be taught in schools' argument.
You did. Defend it or say you mispoke. So, again, who picks the morals to
be taught?
TCB
"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>So, you really do have nothing to offer?
>
>Are there no civic virtues to be taught? Or is it true that all morals
>must derive from belief in absolutes?
>
>
>
>DC
>
>
>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>
>>Good answer, Don, and a fine defense of your argument that 'morals' and
>'value
>>reasoning' should be part of (publicly funded, with my tax dollars) education.
>>
>>
>>TCB
>>
>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Evidently not the atheists....
>>>
>>>DC
>>>
>>>
>>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>So, Don, who decides what morals are taught? And 'me' isn't a fair answer,
>>>>though I know that's what you'd prefer.
>>>>
>>>>TCB
>>>>
>>>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>>>>>>Well done, class! Your answers are all correct, but as usual our bright
>>>>>
>>>>>>young lady is most astute. In the '60s psychiatry started a campaign
>>to
>>>>>
>>>>>> influence the schools and school systems and the teaching colleges
>>in
>>>>>
>>>>>>a big way.
>>>>>
>>>>>There's more to it than this. Part of it is also the cult of IQ and
>the
>>>>>
>>>>>separation of values reasoning and virtue from cognition.
>>>>>
>>>>>It's all intelligence, it's all cognition.
>>>>>
>>>>>But because we have been told we want a values-free education and are
>>>>>foolish enough to accept the illusion of detached neutrality, we separate
>>>>>out certain functions of the mind and call them intelligence while
>>>>>dismissing others as "not intelligence" but wisdom, virtue, honor,
>>>>>decency, etc. So we end up with Teddy Roosevelt's famous comment
>>>>>coming true in our lifetimes:
>>>>>
>>>>>"To educate a man in mind and not in morals is to educate a menace to
>>society."
>>>>>
>>>>>Today, the very idea of society, as a system of shared values and assumed
>>>>>decencies is seen as laughable by a lot of people, while "intelligence"
>>>>is
>>>>>
>>>>>treated by the quasi-educated as silicone is treated by porn stars.
>>>>>
>>>>>I don't like psychiatry much more than you do Bill (though I think there
>>>>>is a place for it in extreme cases where treatment has prevented suicides
>>>>>and murders) but it is not the source of the culture we live in. It
>is
>>>>a
>>>>>symptom not a cause.
>>>>>
>>>>>I am with you on drugs though. I HATE drugs. I have seen more
>>>>>lives, bands, marriages, and great minds ruined by drugs, (and some
of
>>>>>them prescribed drugs), than almost any other single factor.
>>>>>
>>>>>DC
>>>>
>>>
>>
>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>So, again, who picks the morals to be taught?
>
>TCB
Simple enough. Those involved in the conversation.
Do you have something to offer? Because I can assure you, the
conversation is not going away.
Would you derive morals from Hobbes' natural law reasoning?
Social contract theory? Natural selection?
Tell me how you would join the conversation.
After all, it's up to us innit?
Again, have anything to offer?
DCJamie,
As you can tell I feel strongly about this subject, but I do also
appreciate your humor about it.
Indulge me in this and ask yourself this question: Could or would I
prescribe a drug as powerful as crystal meth to a 12 year old boy to
make him more tractable in school?
Jamie K wrote:
>
> Kids have little choice when adults conspire to do EVIL. For example, I
> was subjected to the EVILS of orthodontics! Hauled into a small room
> against my will and tortured with small instruments wielded by sadists.
> Cleverly painful devices were attached to my teeth and wires were
> tightened periodically to keep my teeth in line. Four perfectly good
> teeth were yanked out during the multi-year program of abuse. Drugs were
> used, but never enough. Even after all that, my teeth never admitted
> anything, not even name, rank or serial number.
>
> Granted, now I have straight teeth, but still!
>
> I'm pretty sure the evils of the world can be rightly blamed on
> orthodontists. Millions of kids were subjected to this, and also some
> adults. It is NO ACCIDENT and VERY EVIL. :^)
>
> Meanwhile I have observed a few psychologists and psychiatrists helping
> people straighten out their lives. Not always successfully, there is
> much yet to learn. Just as we will someday find better ways to
> straighten teeth. But I have seen good things happen with the help of
> caring people who seem to be trying to help as best they know how. Some
> prescribing drugs, (our knowledge of brain chemistry and psych drugs
> still seems to be at a fairly experimental stage, I'll give you that),
> and some not.
>
> Cheers,
> -Jamie
> www.JamieKrutz.com
>
>
> Bill L wrote:
>> Sarah, It's hard to confront evil. Sometimes evil people smile and
>> laugh and seem like,they are your friend. But truly evil actions are
>> not done by accident. Can you think of any word other than "evil" for
>> drugging 8 million helpless and innocent children with a harmful and
>> very powerful narcotic? It is NO ACCIDENT and it is VERY EVIL.
>>
>> Confront it.
>>
>> Sarah wrote:
>>> Now, settle down, Bill . . . don't go all Tom Cruise on us.
>>> "Battlefield Earth" was just a book and a movie . . . the
>>> psych-iatrists/ologists are not evil aliens from another galaxy . . .
>>> or ARE they? (dunt dunt duuunnnnn . . . ) Psychs . . . Psychlos .
>>> . . hmmm.
>>>
>>> I admire that Scientology usually demands specifics and personal
>>> observation, but when it comes to psychiatry, it's all broad
>>> generalities. I know a fair number of psychs through my job, and if
>>> there's an evil conspiracy to ruin humanity, I think someone forgot
>>> to clue them in. Now, the pharmaceutical companies . . . that's
>>> another story.
>>>
>>> But thanks for the nice compliment. I should tell you, though, that
>>> I'm not particularly young, and the fact that I can count spilled
>>> toothpicks at a glance doesn't make me bright.
>>>
>>> I'm an excellent driver.
>>>
>>> S
>>>
>>>
>>> "Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message
>>> news:478a535f$1@linux...
>>>> Well done, class! Your answers are all correct, but as usual our
>>>> bright young lady is most astute. In the '60s psychiatry started a
>>>> campaign to influence the schools and school systems and the
>>>> teaching colleges in a big way.
>>>>
>>>> In the '50s at an annual convention, the head of American
>>>> Psychiatric Association publicly declared their new goal of creating
>>>> a "Value Neutral Society". Their aim was to blur and eradicate the
>>>> distinction between right and wrong.
>>>>
>>>> They knew that the sure way to change society was by influencing the
>>>> children. Psychiatrists have gradually introduced to our schools the
>>>> mass drugging of children and even infants (approximately 8 million
>>>> on Ritalin type drugs), Outcome Based Education (doesn't matter how
>>>> much or how well children learn, just that they felt good about it)
>>>> and the rest of their psuchobabble notions of how people should
>>>> think and behave.
>>>>
>>>> Who was the most influential proponent of the "drug culture"? Not
>>>> coincidentally, a psychologist and college professor, Dr. Timothy
>>>> Leary.
>>>>
>>>> When you hear someone derided for being "judgmental", that is the
>>>> influence of psychiatric double speak. Smart, ethical people used to
>>>> be regarded as showing "good judgment", but now that positive
>>>> attribute of being able to rightly judge people and situations has
>>>> been slyly skewed into a bad thing. I'm sure you have noticed other
>>>> examples of how illogical psychiatric concepts have replaced good
>>>> reasoning.
>>>>
>>>> When you look around our society and see the delineation between
>>>> right and wrong, logical and illogical, smart and stupid being
>>>> blurred it is no accident. Look to the only group who has for over
>>>> 50 years had that as their stated aim: psychiatry and psychology.
>>>>
>>>> We can fix our schools but we must first recognize the source of the
>>>> problem and erase its influence or it will only get worse. Our
>>>> children are our responsibility.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> rick wrote:
>>>>> yup, a bunch of egotistical numbnuts. it astounds me the level of non
>>>>> educated college graduates we're churning out...with pride.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, 13 Jan 2008 01:29:11 -0800, "Sarah" <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I think you got it, Don. Psychologists pretending to know
>>>>>> something decided that discipline and competion were harmful to
>>>>>> children's mental health.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> S
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message
>>>>>> news:4789a15e$1@linux...
>>>>>>> Self esteem replaced achievement.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>
>>>I appreciate that everybody has their own viewpoint, but I have no
respect for a person who, in the name of help, puts a child on drugs
just to make them quiet.
And, yes, the drug companies are heavily to blame too. They are about as
slimy an industry as you can find. BUT they could get no where without
the "doctors" who prescribe these harmful drugs.
There was a time the medical profession swore by blood letting for just
about any illness. One day our civilization will look back at the mass
drugging of children (as well as adults) and wonder how the fuck people
could ever have been so barbaric.
I'll drop it now... until the next time!
TCB wrote:
> Hey Bill,
>
> I realize you have strong personal opinions, or more accurately strong visceral
> reactions to the psychiatric profession. I happen to agree that brain meds
> are vastly over prescribed. However, my father is a (retired) counseling
> psychology Ph.D. and my mother is a (ditto) retired high school counselor.
> Trust me, there is no vast conspiracy in the head shrinking community to
> get everyone medicated. The _is_ an easily understood and contemptible conspiracy
> by drug companies to get their drugs prescribed so they make money, but the
> idea that there is some back room cabal of shrinks trying to get us all on
> Zoloft? It just ain't so.
>
> In addition, there are a number of situations where it is stone cold necessary
> to have people highly skilled and trained to deal with personality disorders.
> For example, one of my good friends and fave golfing buddy (he's a freaking
> four handicap, which is incredibly annoying) makes a fair bit of his living
> doing assessments of sex offenders who are up for parole or who have served
> their sentence. Sex offenders are notoriously recidivist criminals but (so
> far) the law doesn't allow them to be held forever. My friend's job is to
> assess those up for parole to make his best judgment about which prisoners
> are unlikely to be a danger to others if released, and also to create programs
> of therapy in the hope that those who have served their full sentence (or
> are paroled) can be prevented from committing further crimes. It agonizing,
> difficult work, and in addition to doing absolutely the best job he can (sometimes
> involving drug therapies) he has a wonderful family and two adorable bloodhounds.
> To paint him, and the many thousands of other well meaning head shrinkers,
> with a single brush as essentially evil scientists is just unfair.
>
> Again, this is obviously a personal thing for you, and that's fine, but keep
> the rhetoric respectful of the people who do the best job they can.
>
> TCB
>
> Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>> Well done, class! Your answers are all correct, but as usual our bright
>
>> young lady is most astute. In the '60s psychiatry started a campaign to
>
>> influence the schools and school systems and the teaching colleges in
>
>> a big way.
>>
>> In the '50s at an annual convention, the head of American Psychiatric
>> Association publicly declared their new goal of creating a "Value
>> Neutral Society". Their aim was to blur and eradicate the distinction
>> between right and wrong.
>>
>> They knew that the sure way to change society was by influencing the
>> children. Psychiatrists have gradually introduced to our schools the
>> mass drugging of children and even infants (approximately 8 million on
>> Ritalin type drugs), Outcome Based Education (doesn't matter how much or
>
>> how well children learn, just that they felt good about it) and the rest
>
>> of their psuchobabble notions of how people should think and behave.
>>
>> Who was the most influential proponent of the "drug culture"? Not
>> coincidentally, a psychologist and college professor, Dr. Timothy Leary.
>>
>> When you hear someone derided for being "judgmental", that is the
>> influence of psychiatric double speak. Smart, ethical people used to be
>
>> regarded as showing "good judgment", but now that positive attribute of
>
>> being able to rightly judge people and situations has been slyly skewed
>
>> into a bad thing. I'm sure you have noticed other examples of how
>> illogical psychiatric concepts have replaced good reasoning.
>>
>> When you look around our society and see the delineation between right
>> and wrong, logical and illogical, smart and stupid being blurred it is
>> no accident. Look to the only group who has for over 50 years had that
>> as their stated aim: psychiatry and psychology.
>>
>> We can fix our schools but we must first recognize the source of the
>> problem and erase its influence or it will only get worse. Our children
>
>> are our responsibility.
>>
>>
>> rick wrote:
>>> yup, a bunch of egotistical numbnuts. it astounds me the level of non
>>> educated college graduates we're churning out...with pride.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, 13 Jan 2008 01:29:11 -0800, "Sarah" <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I think you got it, Don. Psychologists pretending to know something
> decided
>>>> that discipline and competion were harmful to children's mental health.
>>>>
>>>> S
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:4789a15e$1@linux...
>>>>> Self esteem replaced achievement.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>On 15/1/08 8:11 AM, in article 478bc1fe$1@linux, "Jim Rosenthal"
<jrosenthal@lpbenergy.com> wrote:
>
> I have a bunch of sessions that I recorded in Paris that I want
> to work on in Pro Tools LE. Is there an easy (OK- relatively)
> easy way to convert the .paf-.wav, and/or the actual sessions?
> Thanks! -Jim Rosenthal, Dallas, TX (past Ensoniq and EMU rep)
Hi Jim.
Firstly, do a search for the Paf - wav converter, (someone on the NG may
have it), and do a batch convert.
Then you need to bounce each of the tracks from zero to individual files.
Then you can open a PT session and lay the files from zero and it should all
line up perfectly.
Best of luck.
Martin HHey Bill,
Passionate feelings are nothing to scoff at. There is plenty of room for
criticism of the medical industry as a whole and the drug economy in
particular and I agree with some of that criticism.
However, it would be unfair to broadly dismiss psychiatrists and
psychologists as "evil." That would be absurd. It would be more fair to
recognize that, while not perfect practitioners of perfectly understood
science, they have dedicated years of study to be able to help people as
best we know right now. And right now that includes therapy, drugs or
both, for people who are struggling with mental illness.
Our current knowledge of mental health issues is, it seems to me, pretty
young. We have much to learn. But attacking or scapegoating the doctors
is not the way to improve things.
I've never had crystal meth so I can't appreciate your analogy there.
But I'm not a fan of drug therapy unless there is no other effective
avenue of treatment. Even then, much drug therapy is still at a "black
box" stage where the usage is experimental, the results unspecific, and
the side effects risky. The brain itself is also not well understood.
And yet I have seen psych drugs have an overall positive effect in the
lives of people I know, and offer an avenue of hope. Continued research
is important.
So I will respectfully disagree with your overall conclusion and
characterization, while agreeing in various extents with some of your
points.
Thanks for the appreciation of the humor, it really was a nightmare
going to the orthodontist! :^)
Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com
Bill L wrote:
> Jamie,
> As you can tell I feel strongly about this subject, but I do also
> appreciate your humor about it.
>
> Indulge me in this and ask yourself this question: Could or would I
> prescribe a drug as powerful as crystal meth to a 12 year old boy to
> make him more tractable in school?
>
> Jamie K wrote:
>>
>> Kids have little choice when adults conspire to do EVIL. For example,
>> I was subjected to the EVILS of orthodontics! Hauled into a small room
>> against my will and tortured with small instruments wielded by
>> sadists. Cleverly painful devices were attached to my teeth and wires
>> were tightened periodically to keep my teeth in line. Four perfectly
>> good teeth were yanked out during the multi-year program of abuse.
>> Drugs were used, but never enough. Even after all that, my teeth never
>> admitted anything, not even name, rank or serial number.
>>
>> Granted, now I have straight teeth, but still!
>>
>> I'm pretty sure the evils of the world can be rightly blamed on
>> orthodontists. Millions of kids were subjected to this, and also some
>> adults. It is NO ACCIDENT and VERY EVIL. :^)
>>
>> Meanwhile I have observed a few psychologists and psychiatrists
>> helping people straighten out their lives. Not always successfully,
>> there is much yet to learn. Just as we will someday find better ways
>> to straighten teeth. But I have seen good things happen with the help
>> of caring people who seem to be trying to help as best they know how.
>> Some prescribing drugs, (our knowledge of brain chemistry and psych
>> drugs still seems to be at a fairly experimental stage, I'll give you
>> that), and some not.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> -Jamie
>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>
>>
>> Bill L wrote:
>>> Sarah, It's hard to confront evil. Sometimes evil people smile and
>>> laugh and seem like,they are your friend. But truly evil actions are
>>> not done by accident. Can you think of any word other than "evil" for
>>> drugging 8 million helpless and innocent children with a harmful and
>>> very powerful narcotic? It is NO ACCIDENT and it is VERY EVIL.
>>>
>>> Confront it.
>>>
>>> Sarah wrote:
>>>> Now, settle down, Bill . . . don't go all Tom Cruise on us.
>>>> "Battlefield Earth" was just a book and a movie . . . the
>>>> psych-iatrists/ologists are not evil aliens from another galaxy . .
>>>> . or ARE they? (dunt dunt duuunnnnn . . . ) Psychs . . . Psychlos
>>>> . . . hmmm.
>>>>
>>>> I admire that Scientology usually demands specifics and personal
>>>> observation, but when it comes to psychiatry, it's all broad
>>>> generalities. I know a fair number of psychs through my job, and if
>>>> there's an evil conspiracy to ruin humanity, I think someone forgot
>>>> to clue them in. Now, the pharmaceutical companies . . . that's
>>>> another story.
>>>>
>>>> But thanks for the nice compliment. I should tell you, though, that
>>>> I'm not particularly young, and the fact that I can count spilled
>>>> toothpicks at a glance doesn't make me bright.
>>>>
>>>> I'm an excellent driver.
>>>>
>>>> S
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:478a535f$1@linux...
>>>>> Well done, class! Your answers are all correct, but as usual our
>>>>> bright young lady is most astute. In the '60s psychiatry started a
>>>>> campaign to influence the schools and school systems and the
>>>>> teaching colleges in a big way.
>>>>>
>>>>> In the '50s at an annual convention, the head of American
>>>>> Psychiatric Association publicly declared their new goal of
>>>>> creating a "Value Neutral Society". Their aim was to blur and
>>>>> eradicate the distinction between right and wrong.
>>>>>
>>>>> They knew that the sure way to change society was by influencing
>>>>> the children. Psychiatrists have gradually introduced to our
>>>>> schools the mass drugging of children and even infants
>>>>> (approximately 8 million on Ritalin type drugs), Outcome Based
>>>>> Education (doesn't matter how much or how well children learn, just
>>>>> that they felt good about it) and the rest of their psuchobabble
>>>>> notions of how people should think and behave.
>>>>>
>>>>> Who was the most influential proponent of the "drug culture"? Not
>>>>> coincidentally, a psychologist and college professor, Dr. Timothy
>>>>> Leary.
>>>>>
>>>>> When you hear someone derided for being "judgmental", that is the
>>>>> influence of psychiatric double speak. Smart, ethical people used
>>>>> to be regarded as showing "good judgment", but now that positive
>>>>> attribute of being able to rightly judge people and situations has
>>>>> been slyly skewed into a bad thing. I'm sure you have noticed other
>>>>> examples of how illogical psychiatric concepts have replaced good
>>>>> reasoning.
>>>>>
>>>>> When you look around our society and see the delineation between
>>>>> right and wrong, logical and illogical, smart and stupid being
>>>>> blurred it is no accident. Look to the only group who has for over
>>>>> 50 years had that as their stated aim: psychiatry and psychology.
>>>>>
>>>>> We can fix our schools but we must first recognize the source of
>>>>> the problem and erase its influence or it will only get worse. Our
>>>>> children are our responsibility.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> rick wrote:
>>>>>> yup, a bunch of egotistical numbnuts. it astounds me the level of
>>>>>> non
>>>>>> educated college graduates we're churning out...with pride.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sun, 13 Jan 2008 01:29:11 -0800, "Sarah"
>>>>>> <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I think you got it, Don. Psychologists pretending to know
>>>>>>> something decided that discipline and competion were harmful to
>>>>>>> children's mental health.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> S
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>> news:4789a15e$1@linux...
>>>>>>>> Self esteem replaced achievement.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>"jim drago" <jamesd@pros[ect.k12.or.us> wrote:
>Kim any other suggestions
These aren't my suggestions, and I haven't used one, but:
Asrock AM2NF3-VSTA
There was another recommended but I don't seem to have a link here...
Cheers,
Kim.Don,
Thad asked a question, and you did your typical turn it on the asker, instead
of just answering.
Chuck
"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>So, again, who picks the morals to be taught?
>>
>>TCB
>
>
>Simple enough. Those involved in the conversation.
>
>Do you have something to offer? Because I can assure you, the
>conversation is not going away.
>
>Would you derive morals from Hobbes' natural law reasoning?
>Social contract theory? Natural selection?
>
>Tell me how you would join the conversation.
>
>After all, it's up to us innit?
>
>Again, have anything to offer?
>
>DC
>Those who engage the conversation, will pick the things that will
be taught.
There is no other answer.
There may still be common ground enough for a set of virtues to
be agreed upon. I certainly hope so. But, nothing I think will establish
who
does the choosing, and no matter what I say, I will be wrong because it
is a conversation, not an opinion poll.
Right now, millions are opting out of public education because of this
very issue. Christians, Muslims, Scientologists, Jews, all have their own
school systems for this very reason, and now the public school teachers
must often try to teach in a war zone because young people are raised
without morals and parents so often. Many people think it is time for
moral education to re enter public schools.
Which set of morals?
Ours. We decide. Those who participate, that is.
But mark my words, the conversation will occur with or without us.
DC
"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>
>Don,
>
>Thad asked a question, and you did your typical turn it on the asker, instead
>of just answering.
>
>Chuck
>
>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>
>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>So, again, who picks the morals to be taught?
>>>
>>>TCB
>>
>>
>>Simple enough. Those involved in the conversation.
>>
>>Do you have something to offer? Because I can assure you, the
>>conversation is not going away.
>>
>>Would you derive morals from Hobbes' natural law reasoning?
>>Social contract theory? Natural selection?
>>
>>Tell me how you would join the conversation.
>>
>>After all, it's up to us innit?
>>
>>Again, have anything to offer?
>>
>>DC
>>
>Obfuscate all you want, you're digging a hole and hanging curtains. There's
no conversation here, just you being mysterious and vague.
Chuck
"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>Those who engage the conversation, will pick the things that will
>be taught.
>
>There is no other answer.
>
>There may still be common ground enough for a set of virtues to
>be agreed upon. I certainly hope so. But, nothing I think will establish
>who
>does the choosing, and no matter what I say, I will be wrong because it
>is a conversation, not an opinion poll.
>
>Right now, millions are opting out of public education because of this
>very issue. Christians, Muslims, Scientologists, Jews, all have their own
>school systems for this very reason, and now the public school teachers
>must often try to teach in a war zone because young people are raised
>without morals and parents so often. Many people think it is time for
>moral education to re enter public schools.
>
>Which set of morals?
>
>Ours. We decide. Those who participate, that is.
>
>But mark my words, the conversation will occur with or without us.
>
>DC
>
>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>
>>Don,
>>
>>Thad asked a question, and you did your typical turn it on the asker, instead
>>of just answering.
>>
>>Chuck
>>
>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>So, again, who picks the morals to be taught?
>>>>
>>>>TCB
>>>
>>>
>>>Simple enough. Those involved in the conversation.
>>>
>>>Do you have something to offer? Because I can assure you, the
>>>conversation is not going away.
>>>
>>>Would you derive morals from Hobbes' natural law reasoning?
>>>Social contract theory? Natural selection?
>>>
>>>Tell me how you would join the conversation.
>>>
>>>After all, it's up to us innit?
>>>
>>>Again, have anything to offer?
>>>
>>>DC
>>>
>>
>I think there is common ground. I think our traditions provide us with
a set of behaviors we should expect of each other.
Richard Dawkins evidently agrees.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/7136682.stm
The truth is, I do not know which morals will be selected, or should be
because I believe in a secular, (not secularist!) government and those
choices are the product of a people, not a person.
How would you teach morals in grade school? Should we be doing this?
Well, I think so, and I think there is enough common ground to do so
agree?
DC
"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>
>Obfuscate all you want, you're digging a hole and hanging curtains. There's
>no conversation here, just you being mysterious and vague.
>
>Chuck
>
>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>
>>Those who engage the conversation, will pick the things that will
>>be taught.
>>
>>There is no other answer.
>>
>>There may still be common ground enough for a set of virtues to
>>be agreed upon. I certainly hope so. But, nothing I think will establish
>>who
>>does the choosing, and no matter what I say, I will be wrong because it
>>is a conversation, not an opinion poll.
>>
>>Right now, millions are opting out of public education because of this
>>very issue. Christians, Muslims, Scientologists, Jews, all have their
own
>>school systems for this very reason, and now the public school teachers
>>must often try to teach in a war zone because young people are raised
>>without morals and parents so often. Many people think it is time for
>>moral education to re enter public schools.
>>
>>Which set of morals?
>>
>>Ours. We decide. Those who participate, that is.
>>
>>But mark my words, the conversation will occur with or without us.
>>
>>DC
>>
>>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Don,
>>>
>>>Thad asked a question, and you did your typical turn it on the asker,
instead
>>>of just answering.
>>>
>>>Chuck
>>>
>>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>So, again, who picks the morals to be taught?
>>>>>
>>>>>TCB
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Simple enough. Those involved in the conversation.
>>>>
>>>>Do you have something to offer? Because I can assure you, the
>>>>conversation is not going away.
>>>>
>>>>Would you derive morals from Hobbes' natural law reasoning?
>>>>Social contract theory? Natural selection?
>>>>
>>>>Tell me how you would join the conversation.
>>>>
>>>>After all, it's up to us innit?
>>>>
>>>>Again, have anything to offer?
>>>>
>>>>DC
>>>>
>>>
>>
>Now then, here we have the DC rhetorical and debating style at its simplest
and purest. Or rather half of it. There's pit bull DC who will argue anything
to the bitter end and provoke the other party at every turn. Then there is,
grandfatherly DC (this one) who speaks in generalities, answers questions
with questions, and makes swooping appeals to open discussion and earnest
sharing of ideas. Grandfatherly DC shows up in two situations, a) when DC
has provoked the other party into spittle jetting rage ('Now _look_ at what
you're doing, tsk tsk') or b) when he's caught dead to rights. There's also
the convenient chopping up of what other people write to avoid discussing
anything he doesn't want to discuss.
In any case, you missed a chance to make a good, or at least your best, argument
here. You said morals, wisdom, and decency need to be taught alongside 'intelligence'
and I asked who got to choose the morals to be taught. Of course, that's
an almost impossibly difficult question, because at some point someone is
going to object to some of those morals. What you could have argued, to at
least get some breathing space, is that whatever morals should be taught
it shouldn't be that Frankfurt School relativism spouted by elite and effete
east coast Ivy Leaguers like me, which is the status quo. That misrepresents
both me and the status quo, but that's never stopped you before and it's
the best argumentative out you had.
Now then, some parts of a good school curriculum have no moral component.
There's not much ethical spin possible when dealing with the laws of thermodynamics
or the Pythagorean Theorem. The satanist in Brooklyn, the maddrassah teacher
in Peshawar, the Mormon home schooler in Provo, and the radical settler on
the West Bank would all cheerfully agree that the speed of light is about
186,000 miles per second. So what we're really talking about is minimal social
sciences (barely taught outside of college), history, and languages and literature.
So then, if morals and decency are to be taught in public schools, I ask
this time thrice, who gets to decide what is taught?
As a delectable carrot to draw out an answer I offer this. If you answer
that question with any degree of thoughtfulness and thoroughness I will give
you _my_ opinion. And that is the opinion of someone who attended public
schools for twelve years, whose parents both spent their entire working lives
in public education, and who attended a private college where I got to compare
my education to students who graduated in some of the most elite private
and public secondary schools in the world.
This isn't a 'conversation' it's a simple question. Of course you don't have
to answer it, just don't pretend it's something other than what it is.
TCB
"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>So, again, who picks the morals to be taught?
>>
>>TCB
>
>
>Simple enough. Those involved in the conversation.
>
>Do you have something to offer? Because I can assure you, the
>conversation is not going away.
>
>Would you derive morals from Hobbes' natural law reasoning?
>Social contract theory? Natural selection?
>
>Tell me how you would join the conversation.
>
>After all, it's up to us innit?
>
>Again, have anything to offer?
>
>DC
>Now then, here we have the DC rhetorical and debating style at its simplest
and purest. Or rather half of it. There's pit bull DC who will argue anything
to the bitter end and provoke the other party at every turn. Then there is,
grandfatherly DC (this one) who speaks in generalities, answers questions
with questions, and makes swooping appeals to open discussion and earnest
sharing of ideas. Grandfatherly DC shows up in two situations, a) when DC
has provoked the other party into spittle jetting rage ('Now _look_ at what
you're doing, tsk tsk') or b) when he's caught dead to rights. There's also
the convenient chopping up of what other people write to avoid discussing
anything he doesn't want to discuss.
In any case, you missed a chance to make a good, or at least your best, argument
here. You said morals, wisdom, and decency need to be taught alongside 'intelligence'
and I asked who got to choose the morals to be taught. Of course, that's
an almost impossibly difficult question, because at some point someone is
going to object to some of those morals. What you could have argued, to at
least get some breathing space, is that whatever morals should be taught
it shouldn't be that Frankfurt School relativism spouted by elite and effete
east coast Ivy Leaguers like me, which is the status quo. That misrepresents
both me and the status quo, but that's never stopped you before and it's
the best argumentative out you had.
Now then, some parts of a good school curriculum have no moral component.
There's not much ethical spin possible when dealing with the laws of thermodynamics
or the Pythagorean Theorem. The satanist in Brooklyn, the maddrassah teacher
in Peshawar, the Mormon home schooler in Provo, and the radical settler on
the West Bank would all cheerfully agree that the speed of light is about
186,000 miles per second. So what we're really talking about is minimal social
sciences (barely taught outside of college), history, and languages and literature.
So then, if morals and decency are to be taught in public schools, I ask
this time thrice, who gets to decide what is taught?
As a delectable carrot to draw out an answer I offer this. If you answer
that question with any degree of thoughtfulness and thoroughness I will give
you _my_ opinion. And that is the opinion of someone who attended public
schools for twelve years, whose parents both spent their entire working lives
in public education, and who attended a private college where I got to compare
my education to students who graduated in some of the most elite private
and public secondary schools in the world.
This isn't a 'conversation' it's a simple question. Of course you don't have
to answer it, just don't pretend it's something other than what it is.
TCB
"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>So, again, who picks the morals to be taught?
>>
>>TCB
>
>
>Simple enough. Those involved in the conversation.
>
>Do you have something to offer? Because I can assure you, the
>conversation is not going away.
>
>Would you derive morals from Hobbes' natural law reasoning?
>Social contract theory? Natural selection?
>
>Tell me how you would join the conversation.
>
>After all, it's up to us innit?
>
>Again, have anything to offer?
>
>DC
>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>
>Now then, here we have the DC rhetorical and debating style at its simplest
>and purest. Or rather half of it. There's pit bull DC who will argue anything
>to the bitter end and provoke the other party at every turn. Then there
is,
>grandfatherly DC (this one) who speaks in generalities, answers questions
>with questions, and makes swooping appeals to open discussion and earnest
>sharing of ideas. Grandfatherly DC shows up in two situations, a) when DC
>has provoked the other party into spittle jetting rage ('Now _look_ at what
>you're doing, tsk tsk') or b) when he's caught dead to rights. There's also
>the convenient chopping up of what other people write to avoid discussing
>anything he doesn't want to discuss.
This is supposed to be a substitute for content??
How about you? Proud member of the assholes (I'm not a nice guy!)
union? The list pedant, never missing a chance to display his knowledge?
You have to be kidding. Man I edit you to spare you some grief...
(grin)
>In any case, you missed a chance to make a good, or at least your best,
argument
>here. You said morals, wisdom, and decency need to be taught alongside 'intelligence'
>and I asked who got to choose the morals to be taught. Of course, that's
>an almost impossibly difficult question, because at some point someone is
>going to object to some of those morals.
Which of course is not at all the point.
It's not impossible, and it's not even very difficult. It is, however,
collaborative and you have contributed nothing. As usual.
Is there common ground? Can we agree on some basics?
>What you could have argued, to at
>least get some breathing space, is that whatever morals should be taught
>it shouldn't be that Frankfurt School relativism spouted by elite and effete
>east coast Ivy Leaguers like me, which is the status quo. That misrepresents
>both me and the status quo, but that's never stopped you before and it's
>the best argumentative out you had.
Nope. Don't give a damn about your relativism and neither will history.
This country is still a democracy, no matter how much that pisses you
off, and most people have a clear set of morals. They will contribute
where you will not. They will rule. You will not. You will hate them.
That will make you feel special about yourself...
>Now then, some parts of a good school curriculum have no moral component.
>There's not much ethical spin possible when dealing with the laws of thermodynamics
>or the Pythagorean Theorem. The satanist in Brooklyn, the maddrassah teacher
>in Peshawar, the Mormon home schooler in Provo, and the radical settler
on
>the West Bank would all cheerfully agree that the speed of light is about
>186,000 miles per second. So what we're really talking about is minimal
social
>sciences (barely taught outside of college), history, and languages and
literature.
You forgot Zoroastrianism and your friendly local Buddhist, not to
mention your fellow Flying Spaghetti Monster worshipers...
So, It's proven! Nothing can be done!! There can be no morals taught
in schools.
And you call this a position?
>So then, if morals and decency are to be taught in public schools, I ask
>this time thrice, who gets to decide what is taught?
Thrice, he said thrice!! Must be educated...
We the People, that's who. I just reject your thesis, out of hand,
that is it impossible to find common ground.
>As a delectable carrot to draw out an answer I offer this. If you answer
>that question with any degree of thoughtfulness and thoroughness I will
give
>you _my_ opinion. And that is the opinion of someone who attended public
>schools for twelve years, whose parents both spent their entire working
lives
>in public education, and who attended a private college where I got to compare
>my education to students who graduated in some of the most elite private
>and public secondary schools in the world.
>
>This isn't a 'conversation' it's a simple question. Of course you don't
have
>to answer it, just don't pretend it's something other than what it is.
>
>TCB
It's like asking who gets to elect the government. We do.
Do you see any common ground or not?
DCIn a discussion like this it's important to define the terms. In fact
"morals" may not be the most suitable word.
"Moral" is derived from the Latin word "moralis" which means "usage,
customs". Morals are rules of conduct accepted by a society or group and
based on group experience. Morals change with the times and with
different societies. For example to a person who works for his living it
would be immoral to withhold the name of a person who stole. To a
criminal it would be immoral to "rat him out".
The word "ethics" may be a more useful term. Ethics is based on logical
thought, rather than customary accepted behavior. What action would be
the greatest good.
For example sometimes a lie may be the most ethical way to handle a
situation even though morally speaking it would be wrong to lie. George
Washington must have had a hard life if he could really not tell a lie.
Anyway, my point is that people should learn to think logically with
ethics, rather than just follow a moral code (although a moral code is
better than nothing).
Here is a way to make an ethical decision (this comes from the writings
of L Ron Hubbard):
Life could be said to be composed of 8 "dynamics" or "urges toward
survival" as follows:
First Dynamic is the urge toward survival of self.
Second Dynamic is the urge toward survival through a) sex, and b)
children and family
Third Dynamic is the urge toward survival through groups (one's country,
school, company, this newsgroup, etc.)
Fourth is the the urge toward survival through mankind
Fifth is the urge toward survival through living things (animals,
plants, etc.)
Sixth dynamic is the urge toward survival through the physical world:
matter, energy, space, and time
Seventh is the urge toward survival through spirits
Eighth is the urge toward survival through god or infinity
To make an ethical choice just make sure it helps a majority of the 8
dynamics. An optimum survival choice would be one which benefits all
dynamics. Optimum survival is toward infinite survival.
Ideally we should teach our children to think with ethics and to make
their choices towards optimum survival. This will keep them from being
hoodwinked by, for example, a gang's moral code of hating the police and
other rival gangs.
Children need to be given tools for rational thought and logic, not
fixed ideas and certainly not false data or unethical ideas.
Individuality must be fostered, especially in any group activity.
DC wrote:
> Those who engage the conversation, will pick the things that will
> be taught.
>
> There is no other answer.
>
> There may still be common ground enough for a set of virtues to
> be agreed upon. I certainly hope so. But, nothing I think will establish
> who
> does the choosing, and no matter what I say, I will be wrong because it
> is a conversation, not an opinion poll.
>
> Right now, millions are opting out of public education because of this
> very issue. Christians, Muslims, Scientologists, Jews, all have their own
> school systems for this very reason, and now the public school teachers
> must often try to teach in a war zone because young people are raised
> without morals and parents so often. Many people think it is time for
> moral education to re enter public schools.
>
> Which set of morals?
>
> Ours. We decide. Those who participate, that is.
>
> But mark my words, the conversation will occur with or without us.
>
> DC
>
> "chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>> Don,
>>
>> Thad asked a question, and you did your typical turn it on the asker, instead
>> of just answering.
>>
>> Chuck
>>
>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>> So, again, who picks the morals to be taught?
>>>>
>>>> TCB
>>>
>>> Simple enough. Those involved in the conversation.
>>>
>>> Do you have something to offer? Because I can assure you, the
>>> conversation is not going away.
>>>
>>> Would you derive morals from Hobbes' natural law reasoning?
>>> Social contract theory? Natural selection?
>>>
>>> Tell me how you would join the conversation.
>>>
>>> After all, it's up to us innit?
>>>
>>> Again, have anything to offer?
>>>
>>> DC
>>>
>FWIW, I have both versions of PAFWAVCONVERT (one that works on
98/ME and one that works on WINXP), so Jim, if you need them, send me an
e-mail at:
neil DOT henderson AT sbcglobal DOT net, and i'll send them to
you, no problem, since they were both free releases.
Neil
Martin Harrington <lendan@bigpond.net.au> wrote:
>On 15/1/08 8:11 AM, in article 478bc1fe$1@linux, "Jim Rosenthal"
><jrosenthal@lpbenergy.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> I have a bunch of sessions that I recorded in Paris that I want
>> to work on in Pro Tools LE. Is there an easy (OK- relatively)
>> easy way to convert the .paf-.wav, and/or the actual sessions?
>> Thanks! -Jim Rosenthal, Dallas, TX (past Ensoniq and EMU rep)
>Hi Jim.
>Firstly, do a search for the Paf - wav converter, (someone on the NG may
>have it), and do a batch convert.
>Then you need to bounce each of the tracks from zero to individual files.
>Then you can open a PT session and lay the files from zero and it should
all
>line up perfectly.
>Best of luck.
>Martin H
>>This country is still a democracy, no matter how much that pisses you
>off,
errrrr..........just one small point. This country is not a democracy and
never has been. It is a representative republic with a bicameral legislature
which was specifically created to protect minority rights from the tyranny
majority rule, which is the essence of the definition of democracy. In this
country, we do employ a democratic "method" wherein the those who are legally
entitled to vote (the electorate) choose legislators who are, in turn, subject
to the rules as set out in the constitution and interpreted by the courts.
Just a small point........but perhaps important to some degree.
;o)
OK..now I'm gonna put on my flame suit and cover up."Morgan" <morganp@ntplx.net> wrote:
>Greetings !
>Some of you know of my involvement with:
>http://www.palmtreetechnology.com/
>
>Palmtree Technology will be Speaking at the META session @ Namm
>introducing a revolutionary new CODEC ( Details on Palmtree site )
>
>If anyone is interested in attending - admission is FREE , seating is
>limited
>Please let me know :)
>
>Morgan
>Eastcoast Music Mall
>800-901-2001
>morganp@ntplx.net
>
Morgan-
I suspect everyone here on the NG would be very interested in Palmtree, from
what I just read at the site.
-steve
for those who haven't checked it out, they claim a new compression method
that can maintain CD quality while reducing the file to half that of an mp3...In the case of selecting school standards it is essentially a democracy
of the engaged. (that then has to play political football with the
unengaged) In other words, the more you get involved the more say
you have.
Over the last few years, I have been involved in a couple of local committees
both city and county, and two things have impressed me:
It's actually quite easy to get involved and have your voice heard. (That
doesn't mean anyone is listening of course...)
Those people serving in these roles tend to be good folks and not
ideologues.
My point? Just as with school Science standards (and I am against the
mandated teaching of either creationism or ID) those with a burden on
the issue hold the conversation. There WILL be a conversation however,
especially on the teaching of virtue to young people. Then, some
consensus is formed, that hopefully will not upset either the militant
secularists, nor the conservative theists too much (though neither
side will get what they really want) and this is presented to the public
and made into policy. Then the activists try to get "the bums" who
passed this garbage all recalled and the policy nullified. They may succeed.
If they do not, the policy stands. The one group that gets well and truly
steamrollered are those who think the whole project is impossible.
It's not. Consensus is achievable.
And anyone who doesn't think that we have a real problem in
our public schools is in deep denial.
DC
"Deej" <noway@jose.net> wrote:
>
>
>>This country is still a democracy, no matter how much that pisses you
>>off,
>
>errrrr..........just one small point. This country is not a democracy and
>never has been. It is a representative republic with a bicameral legislature
>which was specifically created to protect minority rights from the tyranny
>majority rule, which is the essence of the definition of democracy. In this
>country, we do employ a democratic "method" wherein the those who are legally
>entitled to vote (the electorate) choose legislators who are, in turn, subject
>to the rules as set out in the constitution and interpreted by the courts.
>
>
>Just a small point........but perhaps important to some degree.
>
>;o)
>
>OK..now I'm gonna put on my flame suit and cover up.
>
>If you have Paris3, you can do these things inside the program with
"Render track to disk" and then export the fie(s) as "Audio object" or
"Stereo file" in wave format.
Erling
On 15 Jan 2008 07:11:42 +1000, "Jim Rosenthal"
<jrosenthal@lpbenergy.com> wrote:
>
>I have a bunch of sessions that I recorded in Paris that I want
>to work on in Pro Tools LE. Is there an easy (OK- relatively)
>easy way to convert the .paf-.wav, and/or the actual sessions?
>Thanks! -Jim Rosenthal, Dallas, TX (past Ensoniq and EMU rep)great...dumb but sane...is that marketable?
On Mon, 14 Jan 2008 04:38:06 -0800, "Sarah" <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com>
wrote:
>Smarter? Naaa. Loonier maybe. If you were loonier you would have thought
>of that.
>
>S
>
>"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:2mamo3hjje0huv008c9bbq55efk88mc94r@4ax.com...
>> and if i were smarter i would have thought of that...
>>
>> On Sun, 13 Jan 2008 03:16:51 -0800, "Sarah" <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>"Ignoransk is blisk" - Popeye
>>>
>>>S
>>>
>>>"rick" <parnell68@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>>news:32qjo3tacag3k1niba4n0sdgo18aafjb5v@4ax.com...
>>>> but they're happy...afterall ignorance is bliss.
>>>>
>>>> On 13 Jan 2008 14:09:17 +1000, "Deej" <noway@jose.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>>>>>>You are spot on. Our educational system started to decline in the late
>>>>>>'60s and has never recovered
>>>>>>
>>>>>>In analyzing a changing trend in a statistic, such as the decline in
>>>>>>the
>>>>>
>>>>>>quality of the US school system, what you must do is look just BEFORE
>>>>>>the change occurred to find what caused it. What changed in the US
>>>>>>school system that has caused the drastic reduction in results?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Discuss please...
>>>>>
>>>>>Taking the emphasis off competition, pass/ fail grading and passing
>>>>>students
>>>>>
>>>>>along without them being able to accomplish the coursework.
>>>>
>>>
>>
>That is the easiest way to go. Select all tracks then render to disk, then
export. I don't know of anything else that will capture all the edits, and
there's no way I know of to get the actual project to the PT platform
Chuck
erlilo <erling.lovik@lyse.net> wrote:
>If you have Paris3, you can do these things inside the program with
>"Render track to disk" and then export the fie(s) as "Audio object" or
>"Stereo file" in wave format.
>
>Erling
>
>On 15 Jan 2008 07:11:42 +1000, "Jim Rosenthal"
><jrosenthal@lpbenergy.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>I have a bunch of sessions that I recorded in Paris that I want
>>to work on in Pro Tools LE. Is there an easy (OK- relatively)
>>easy way to convert the .paf-.wav, and/or the actual sessions?
>>Thanks! -Jim Rosenthal, Dallas, TX (past Ensoniq and EMU rep)Bill,
I have no trouble "confronting" evil or anything else you want me to
confront. I just don't like broad generalities, and you shouldn't either,
since dealing in broad generalities is a characteristic Mr Hubbard has
assigned to the antisocial personality.
I think it works like this:
1. Drug companies make drugs. Sometimes they even make up diseases to
market the drugs. (Restless leg syndrome? Please . . . ) Sometimes they
even neglect to inform us about the risks and side effects.
2. People have aches, pains, and problems. They want relief, and if
they can get it from a pill, all the better. Much less work that way.
3. Doctors are under pressure to fix people's aches, pains, and
problems, and if they can do it with a pill, all the better. Much less work
that way.
See? It's a perfect kinky three-way relationship. No conspiracy, just
people being their usual crazy selves.
But if you're going to have this be a big conspiracy, you better include
the parents and teachers in on it. No one is forcing parents to drug their
kids. I had a problem child, and I didn't drug him. The school wanted us
to, and we said, "NO!" Children are all individual people who learn in
different ways and at different rates, and I'm not going to drug him just
because they can't figure how to teach him.
Some shrinks drug their patients, others don't. I'm not buying the big
faceless EVIL. It's just the pharmaceutical-medical-patient triangle at
work.
Many years ago, the American Psychiatric Association rejected and
criticized Dianetics/Scientology, and ever since then the Church of
Scientology has been following L. Ron's policy to attack the attackers,
rather than defend the Church. The entire profession of psychiatry became
"fair game." Is it possible that, as a loyal member of the COS, this
decades old conflict is an element of your passionate feelings about psychs?
Can you confront that possibility?
I agree philosophically about the use of psychiatric drugs on children
(and adults for that matter), but broad generalities are just not at all
persuasive or helpful.
Peace,
Sarah(tonin re-uptake inhibitor)
"Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message news:478b7089@linux...
> Sarah, It's hard to confront evil. Sometimes evil people smile and laugh
> and seem like,they are your friend. But truly evil actions are not done by
> accident. Can you think of any word other than "evil" for drugging 8
> million helpless and innocent children with a harmful and very powerful
> narcotic? It is NO ACCIDENT and it is VERY EVIL.
>
> Confront it.
>
> Sarah wrote:
>> Now, settle down, Bill . . . don't go all Tom Cruise on us. "Battlefield
>> Earth" was just a book and a movie . . . the psych-iatrists/ologists are
>> not evil aliens from another galaxy . . . or ARE they? (dunt dunt
>> duuunnnnn . . . ) Psychs . . . Psychlos . . . hmmm.
>>
>> I admire that Scientology usually demands specifics and personal
>> observation, but when it comes to psychiatry, it's all broad
>> generalities. I know a fair number of psychs through my job, and if
>> there's an evil conspiracy to ruin humanity, I think someone forgot to
>> clue them in. Now, the pharmaceutical companies . . . that's another
>> story.
>>
>> But thanks for the nice compliment. I should tell you, though, that I'm
>> not particularly young, and the fact that I can count spilled toothpicks
>> at a glance doesn't make me bright.
>>
>> I'm an excellent driver.
>>
>> S
>>
>>
>> "Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message
>> news:478a535f$1@linux...
>>> Well done, class! Your answers are all correct, but as usual our bright
>>> young lady is most astute. In the '60s psychiatry started a campaign to
>>> influence the schools and school systems and the teaching colleges in a
>>> big way.
>>>
>>> In the '50s at an annual convention, the head of American Psychiatric
>>> Association publicly declared their new goal of creating a "Value
>>> Neutral Society". Their aim was to blur and eradicate the distinction
>>> between right and wrong.
>>>
>>> They knew that the sure way to change society was by influencing the
>>> children. Psychiatrists have gradually introduced to our schools the
>>> mass drugging of children and even infants (approximately 8 million on
>>> Ritalin type drugs), Outcome Based Education (doesn't matter how much or
>>> how well children learn, just that they felt good about it) and the rest
>>> of their psuchobabble notions of how people should think and behave.
>>>
>>> Who was the most influential proponent of the "drug culture"? Not
>>> coincidentally, a psychologist and college professor, Dr. Timothy Leary.
>>>
>>> When you hear someone derided for being "judgmental", that is the
>>> influence of psychiatric double speak. Smart, ethical people used to be
>>> regarded as showing "good judgment", but now that positive attribute of
>>> being able to rightly judge people and situations has been slyly skewed
>>> into a bad thing. I'm sure you have noticed other examples of how
>>> illogical psychiatric concepts have replaced good reasoning.
>>>
>>> When you look around our society and see the delineation between right
>>> and wrong, logical and illogical, smart and stupid being blurred it is
>>> no accident. Look to the only group who has for over 50 years had that
>>> as their stated aim: psychiatry and psychology.
>>>
>>> We can fix our schools but we must first recognize the source of the
>>> problem and erase its influence or it will only get worse. Our children
>>> are our responsibility.
>>>
>>>
>>> rick wrote:
>>>> yup, a bunch of egotistical numbnuts. it astounds me the level of non
>>>> educated college graduates we're churning out...with pride.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, 13 Jan 2008 01:29:11 -0800, "Sarah" <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I think you got it, Don. Psychologists pretending to know something
>>>>> decided that discipline and competion were harmful to children's
>>>>> mental health.
>>>>>
>>>>> S
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:4789a15e$1@linux...
>>>>>> Self esteem replaced achievement.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>Hi everybody,
I'm redoing the acoustics of my room at home and I'm using suggestions for
bass traps and absorbers from Ethan Winer http://www.ethanwiner.com/acoustics.html
What I would need now is a software (Mac) to measure the nasty ringing frequencies
at a given spot so I can install absorbers and diffusers accurately.
I found this on the net http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/25161& vid=470175&mode=info
Anyone familiar with this, or maybe other suggestions?
Any help in this domain is highly appreciated.
Best regards,
AbThis has been an interesting thread for me. We just took Jacob, our 10 year
old son, out of an expensive private school that we couldn't afford because
he has a multitude of "learning disorders" that they weren't equipped to
deal with. Our final decision (for now, at least) is to home school him
(and possibly his little sister depending on how the financial aide negotiations
go) but we did investigate our local public elementary school. We met with
the principle who, upon hearing about Jake's LD issues, asked "well, is he
on medication?". We explained about both his biological parents being alcoholic/drug
addicts and our trepidation about putting a kid with such a high genetic
predisposition for addiction on highly addictive drugs such as Ritalin (which
we just thought was bad speed back in the day) or Adderall (which is just
another name for Dexidrine, which was GOOD speed back in the day). Her response
was to look at my wife and say "Well, you don't leave home without your glasses,
do you?". Sorry. Wrong answer for us. I should also mention that this
school is a double magnet school with high enough average test scores to
qualify for two "resource" (special ed) teachers. For over 400 kids. Plus,
the expensive testing
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| Re: Snow [message #93012 is a reply to message #93011] |
Sat, 24 November 2007 13:58  |
steve the artguy
Messages: 308
Registered: June 2005
|
Senior Member |
|
|
>>>Those who engage the conversation, will pick the things that will
>>>be taught.
>>>
>>>There is no other answer.
>>>
>>>There may still be common ground enough for a set of virtues to
>>>be agreed upon. I certainly hope so. But, nothing I think will establish
>>>who
>>>does the choosing, and no matter what I say, I will be wrong because it
>>>is a conversation, not an opinion poll.
>>>
>>>Right now, millions are opting out of public education because of this
>>>very issue. Christians, Muslims, Scientologists, Jews, all have their
>own
>>>school systems for this very reason, and now the public school teachers
>>>must often try to teach in a war zone because young people are raised
>>>without morals and parents so often. Many people think it is time for
>>>moral education to re enter public schools.
>>>
>>>Which set of morals?
>>>
>>>Ours. We decide. Those who participate, that is.
>>>
>>>But mark my words, the conversation will occur with or without us.
>>>
>>>DC
>>>
>>>"chuck duffy" <c@c.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>Don,
>>>>
>>>>Thad asked a question, and you did your typical turn it on the asker,
>instead
>>>>of just answering.
>>>>
>>>>Chuck
>>>>
>>>>"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>So, again, who picks the morals to be taught?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>TCB
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Simple enough. Those involved in the conversation.
>>>>>
>>>>>Do you have something to offer? Because I can assure you, the
>>>>>conversation is not going away.
>>>>>
>>>>>Would you derive morals from Hobbes' natural law reasoning?
>>>>>Social contract theory? Natural selection?
>>>>>
>>>>>Tell me how you would join the conversation.
>>>>>
>>>>>After all, it's up to us innit?
>>>>>
>>>>>Again, have anything to offer?
>>>>>
>>>>>DC
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>at least Jake has parents who care enough to ask if this is really the
right or only choice...hats off to you both.
On 16 Jan 2008 00:58:19 +1000, "Gantt Kushner" <ganttmann@comcast.net>
wrote:
>
>This has been an interesting thread for me. We just took Jacob, our 10 year
>old son, out of an expensive private school that we couldn't afford because
>he has a multitude of "learning disorders" that they weren't equipped to
>deal with. Our final decision (for now, at least) is to home school him
>(and possibly his little sister depending on how the financial aide negotiations
>go) but we did investigate our local public elementary school. We met with
>the principle who, upon hearing about Jake's LD issues, asked "well, is he
>on medication?". We explained about both his biological parents being alcoholic/drug
>addicts and our trepidation about putting a kid with such a high genetic
>predisposition for addiction on highly addictive drugs such as Ritalin (which
>we just thought was bad speed back in the day) or Adderall (which is just
>another name for Dexidrine, which was GOOD speed back in the day). Her response
>was to look at my wife and say "Well, you don't leave home without your glasses,
>do you?". Sorry. Wrong answer for us. I should also mention that this
>school is a double magnet school with high enough average test scores to
>qualify for two "resource" (special ed) teachers. For over 400 kids. Plus,
>the expensive testing that we had done to prove his special needs weren't
>isn't good enough for Montgomery County. If his teacher decides that he
>has problems they'll have the county people test him. Which means that he
>has to fail twice to get help - once in his old school and again in his new
>school.
>
>Anyway. I suppose I got off the topic! I must have needed to vent.
>
>Gantt
>
>"Sarah" <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com> wrote:
>>Bill,
>>
>> I have no trouble "confronting" evil or anything else you want me to
>
>>confront. I just don't like broad generalities, and you shouldn't either,
>
>>since dealing in broad generalities is a characteristic Mr Hubbard has
>>assigned to the antisocial personality.
>>
>> I think it works like this:
>>
>> 1. Drug companies make drugs. Sometimes they even make up diseases to
>
>>market the drugs. (Restless leg syndrome? Please . . . ) Sometimes they
>
>>even neglect to inform us about the risks and side effects.
>> 2. People have aches, pains, and problems. They want relief, and if
>
>>they can get it from a pill, all the better. Much less work that way.
>> 3. Doctors are under pressure to fix people's aches, pains, and
>>problems, and if they can do it with a pill, all the better. Much less
>work
>>that way.
>>
>> See? It's a perfect kinky three-way relationship. No conspiracy, just
>
>>people being their usual crazy selves.
>>
>> But if you're going to have this be a big conspiracy, you better include
>
>>the parents and teachers in on it. No one is forcing parents to drug their
>
>>kids. I had a problem child, and I didn't drug him. The school wanted
>us
>>to, and we said, "NO!" Children are all individual people who learn in
>>different ways and at different rates, and I'm not going to drug him just
>
>>because they can't figure how to teach him.
>>
>> Some shrinks drug their patients, others don't. I'm not buying the
>big
>>faceless EVIL. It's just the pharmaceutical-medical-patient triangle at
>
>>work.
>>
>> Many years ago, the American Psychiatric Association rejected and
>>criticized Dianetics/Scientology, and ever since then the Church of
>>Scientology has been following L. Ron's policy to attack the attackers,
>
>>rather than defend the Church. The entire profession of psychiatry became
>
>>"fair game." Is it possible that, as a loyal member of the COS, this
>>decades old conflict is an element of your passionate feelings about psychs?
>
>>Can you confront that possibility?
>>
>> I agree philosophically about the use of psychiatric drugs on children
>
>>(and adults for that matter), but broad generalities are just not at all
>
>>persuasive or helpful.
>>
>>Peace,
>>
>>Sarah(tonin re-uptake inhibitor)
>>
>>
>>"Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message news:478b7089@linux...
>>> Sarah, It's hard to confront evil. Sometimes evil people smile and laugh
>
>>> and seem like,they are your friend. But truly evil actions are not done
>by
>>> accident. Can you think of any word other than "evil" for drugging 8
>>> million helpless and innocent children with a harmful and very powerful
>
>>> narcotic? It is NO ACCIDENT and it is VERY EVIL.
>>>
>>> Confront it.
>>>
>>> Sarah wrote:
>>>> Now, settle down, Bill . . . don't go all Tom Cruise on us. "Battlefield
>
>>>> Earth" was just a book and a movie . . . the psych-iatrists/ologists
>are
>>>> not evil aliens from another galaxy . . . or ARE they? (dunt dunt
>>>> duuunnnnn . . . ) Psychs . . . Psychlos . . . hmmm.
>>>>
>>>> I admire that Scientology usually demands specifics and personal
>>>> observation, but when it comes to psychiatry, it's all broad
>>>> generalities. I know a fair number of psychs through my job, and if
>>>> there's an evil conspiracy to ruin humanity, I think someone forgot to
>
>>>> clue them in. Now, the pharmaceutical companies . . . that's another
>
>>>> story.
>>>>
>>>> But thanks for the nice compliment. I should tell you, though, that
>I'm
>>>> not particularly young, and the fact that I can count spilled toothpicks
>
>>>> at a glance doesn't make me bright.
>>>>
>>>> I'm an excellent driver.
>>>>
>>>> S
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:478a535f$1@linux...
>>>>> Well done, class! Your answers are all correct, but as usual our bright
>
>>>>> young lady is most astute. In the '60s psychiatry started a campaign
>to
>>>>> influence the schools and school systems and the teaching colleges in
>a
>>>>> big way.
>>>>>
>>>>> In the '50s at an annual convention, the head of American Psychiatric
>
>>>>> Association publicly declared their new goal of creating a "Value
>>>>> Neutral Society". Their aim was to blur and eradicate the distinction
>
>>>>> between right and wrong.
>>>>>
>>>>> They knew that the sure way to change society was by influencing the
>
>>>>> children. Psychiatrists have gradually introduced to our schools the
>
>>>>> mass drugging of children and even infants (approximately 8 million
>on
>>>>> Ritalin type drugs), Outcome Based Education (doesn't matter how much
>or
>>>>> how well children learn, just that they felt good about it) and the
>rest
>>>>> of their psuchobabble notions of how people should think and behave.
>>>>>
>>>>> Who was the most influential proponent of the "drug culture"? Not
>>>>> coincidentally, a psychologist and college professor, Dr. Timothy Leary.
>>>>>
>>>>> When you hear someone derided for being "judgmental", that is the
>>>>> influence of psychiatric double speak. Smart, ethical people used to
>be
>>>>> regarded as showing "good judgment", but now that positive attribute
>of
>>>>> being able to rightly judge people and situations has been slyly skewed
>
>>>>> into a bad thing. I'm sure you have noticed other examples of how
>>>>> illogical psychiatric concepts have replaced good reasoning.
>>>>>
>>>>> When you look around our society and see the delineation between right
>
>>>>> and wrong, logical and illogical, smart and stupid being blurred it
>is
>>>>> no accident. Look to the only group who has for over 50 years had that
>
>>>>> as their stated aim: psychiatry and psychology.
>>>>>
>>>>> We can fix our schools but we must first recognize the source of the
>
>>>>> problem and erase its influence or it will only get worse. Our children
>
>>>>> are our responsibility.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> rick wrote:
>>>>>> yup, a bunch of egotistical numbnuts. it astounds me the level of
>non
>>>>>> educated college graduates we're churning out...with pride.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sun, 13 Jan 2008 01:29:11 -0800, "Sarah" <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I think you got it, Don. Psychologists pretending to know something
>
>>>>>>> decided that discipline and competion were harmful to children's
>>>>>>> mental health.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> S
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:4789a15e$1@linux...
>>>>>>>> Self esteem replaced achievement.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>it's a shame he doesn't have a chance in hell...
On Tue, 15 Jan 2008 09:15:50 -0500, Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com>
wrote:
>To quote myself, "...our Fed Reserve just keeps on printing new dollars
>every time they feel like having an extra juicy profit." Who gets rich
>in war time? Central bankers! They love war time, lending money to both
>sides at exorbitant interest rates.
>
>You do realize who gets screwed by inflation? People who work for a
>living and people who save money. Do you still think we can afford this
>war and our bought and paid for Presidents?
>
>Are you hearing Ron Paul yet?
>
>PS: Martin, I know this is OT and may not seem to apply to Australia,
>but please don't ignore it. You will somehow feel the effects of it,
>too. Sorry.What kind of mic do you need and how do you input it into the mac?
"Ab" <ab.vangoor@wanadoo.fr> wrote:
>
>Hi everybody,
>
>I'm redoing the acoustics of my room at home and I'm using suggestions for
>bass traps and absorbers from Ethan Winer http://www.ethanwiner.com/acoustics.html
>
>What I would need now is a software (Mac) to measure the nasty ringing frequencies
>at a given spot so I can install absorbers and diffusers accurately.
>I found this on the net http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/25161& vid=470175&mode=info
>Anyone familiar with this, or maybe other suggestions?
>Any help in this domain is highly appreciated.
>
>Best regards,
>Ab"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>So, Don, you're doing just what Dawkins says shouldn't be done.
Thank God...
> He says 'I
>like singing Christmas carols' and you take that to mean 'I believe in a
>common set of Christian values' where in fact he argues extensively, and
>repeatedly, that Christian values as represented in scripture and the actions
>of fundamentalist Christians are anathema to him.
It wasn't about Christian values, though they are certainly derived from
Christianity; it was about common, shared values of how others should
be treated and some basic virtues he clearly holds in common.
I thought you could make the mental connection there. Sorry.
DC"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>
>Well, you still didn't answer my question, so I guess that's that.
I rejected your premise, which you finally divulged, that it is impossible
to find common ground. I showed you where common ground is found
by people every day, and I described the process by which Americans
choose school goals and curricula. The answer is we get to choose, and
will do so.
You didn't like the answer. Oh well...
DCGantt,
I too want to praise you and your wife's wonderful dedication to your
son and his future. He's a lucky guy.
DCYou can pretty well cut the cost by 2/3rds if you are able to do the DIY
thing
www.recording.org has a acoustics thread...check it out
also John L. Sayers forum at http://www.johnlsayers.com/phpBB2/index.php
Lot's of good ideas as well as experienced people to answer your questions
As for software I used ETF 1.5 as well as a couple of others but
unfortunately I lost them when my Laptop died
Don
"Ab" <ab.vangoor@wanadoo.fr> wrote in message news:478cba32$1@linux...
>
> Hi everybody,
>
> I'm redoing the acoustics of my room at home and I'm using suggestions for
> bass traps and absorbers from Ethan Winer
> http://www.ethanwiner.com/acoustics.html
>
> What I would need now is a software (Mac) to measure the nasty ringing
> frequencies
> at a given spot so I can install absorbers and diffusers accurately.
> I found this on the net
> http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/25161& vid=470175&mode=info
> Anyone familiar with this, or maybe other suggestions?
> Any help in this domain is highly appreciated.
>
> Best regards,
> AbI was thinking of using a B&K 4006 (omni) through Metric Halo ULN2 interface.
I'd only need the software.
Regards,
Ab
"Cujo" <chris@applemanstudio.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>What kind of mic do you need and how do you input it into the mac?
>
>"Ab" <ab.vangoor@wanadoo.fr> wrote:
>>
>>Hi everybody,
>>
>>I'm redoing the acoustics of my room at home and I'm using suggestions
for
>>bass traps and absorbers from Ethan Winer http://www.ethanwiner.com/acoustics.html
>>
>>What I would need now is a software (Mac) to measure the nasty ringing
frequencies
>>at a given spot so I can install absorbers and diffusers accurately.
>>I found this on the net http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/25161& vid=470175&mode=info
>>Anyone familiar with this, or maybe other suggestions?
>>Any help in this domain is highly appreciated.
>>
>>Best regards,
>>Ab
>SpectraFoo is great if you want to spen the money.....
"Ab" <ab.vangoor@wanadoo.fr> wrote in message news:478cba32$1@linux...
>
> Hi everybody,
>
> I'm redoing the acoustics of my room at home and I'm using suggestions for
> bass traps and absorbers from Ethan Winer
http://www.ethanwiner.com/acoustics.html
>
> What I would need now is a software (Mac) to measure the nasty ringing
frequencies
> at a given spot so I can install absorbers and diffusers accurately.
> I found this on the net
http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/25161& vid=470175&mode=info
> Anyone familiar with this, or maybe other suggestions?
> Any help in this domain is highly appreciated.
>
> Best regards,
> AbBill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>To quote myself, "...our Fed Reserve just keeps on printing new dollars
>every time they feel like having an extra juicy profit." Who gets rich
>in war time? Central bankers! They love war time, lending money to both
>sides at exorbitant interest rates.
>
>You do realize who gets screwed by inflation? People who work for a
>living and people who save money. Do you still think we can afford this
>war and our bought and paid for Presidents?
>
>Are you hearing Ron Paul yet?
>
>PS: Martin, I know this is OT and may not seem to apply to Australia,
>but please don't ignore it. You will somehow feel the effects of it,
>too. Sorry.Where did you get that number? It is roughly twice what has been reporteed
by any other source I have seen.
Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>To quote myself, "...our Fed Reserve just keeps on printing new dollars
>every time they feel like having an extra juicy profit." Who gets rich
>in war time? Central bankers! They love war time, lending money to both
>sides at exorbitant interest rates.
>
>You do realize who gets screwed by inflation? People who work for a
>living and people who save money. Do you still think we can afford this
>war and our bought and paid for Presidents?
>
>Are you hearing Ron Paul yet?
>
>PS: Martin, I know this is OT and may not seem to apply to Australia,
>but please don't ignore it. You will somehow feel the effects of it,
>too. Sorry.http://www.mydamnchannel.com/channel.aspx?episode=207I agree, I use MH interfaces all the time but hoped to get along with a less
pricier software for my needs. Thanks anyway.
Regards
Ab
"tonehouse" <zmcleod@comcast.net> wrote:
>SpectraFoo is great if you want to spen the money.....
>"Ab" <ab.vangoor@wanadoo.fr> wrote in message news:478cba32$1@linux...
>>
>> Hi everybody,
>>
>> I'm redoing the acoustics of my room at home and I'm using suggestions
for
>> bass traps and absorbers from Ethan Winer
>http://www.ethanwiner.com/acoustics.html
>>
>> What I would need now is a software (Mac) to measure the nasty ringing
>frequencies
>> at a given spot so I can install absorbers and diffusers accurately.
>> I found this on the net
> http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/25161& vid=470175&mode=info
>> Anyone familiar with this, or maybe other suggestions?
>> Any help in this domain is highly appreciated.
>>
>> Best regards,
>> Ab
>
>I've been reading a bit about The Sudbury Valley School. It's interesting
stuff:
http://books.google.com/books?id=es2nOuZE0rAC&dq=daniel+ greenberg+sudberry+valley&pg=PP1&ots=TkGUQdxgDF& sig=KLBWjwcLwbKThsuAWg8rjLi5z4c&hl=en&prev=http://ww w.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en-us&q=daniel +greenberg+sudberry+valley&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&sa= X&oi=print&ct=title&cad=one-book-with-thumbnail# PPA2,M1
I'm sure some of you will have opinions!
Gantt
"Gantt Kushner" <ganttmann@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>This has been an interesting thread for me. We just took Jacob, our 10
year
>old son, out of an expensive private school that we couldn't afford because
>he has a multitude of "learning disorders" that they weren't equipped to
>deal with. Our final decision (for now, at least) is to home school him
>(and possibly his little sister depending on how the financial aide negotiations
>go) but we did investigate our local public elementary school. We met with
>the principle who, upon hearing about Jake's LD issues, asked "well, is
he
>on medication?". We explained about both his biological parents being alcoholic/drug
>addicts and our trepidation about putting a kid with such a high genetic
>predisposition for addiction on highly addictive drugs such as Ritalin (which
>we just thought was bad speed back in the day) or Adderall (which is just
>another name for Dexidrine, which was GOOD speed back in the day). Her
response
>was to look at my wife and say "Well, you don't leave home without your
glasses,
>do you?". Sorry. Wrong answer for us. I should also mention that this
>school is a double magnet school with high enough average test scores to
>qualify for two "resource" (special ed) teachers. For over 400 kids. Plus,
>the expensive testing that we had done to prove his special needs weren't
>isn't good enough for Montgomery County. If his teacher decides that he
>has problems they'll have the county people test him. Which means that
he
>has to fail twice to get help - once in his old school and again in his
new
>school.
>
>Anyway. I suppose I got off the topic! I must have needed to vent.
>
>Gantt
>
>"Sarah" <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com> wrote:
>>Bill,
>>
>> I have no trouble "confronting" evil or anything else you want me to
>
>>confront. I just don't like broad generalities, and you shouldn't either,
>
>>since dealing in broad generalities is a characteristic Mr Hubbard has
>>assigned to the antisocial personality.
>>
>> I think it works like this:
>>
>> 1. Drug companies make drugs. Sometimes they even make up diseases
to
>
>>market the drugs. (Restless leg syndrome? Please . . . ) Sometimes they
>
>>even neglect to inform us about the risks and side effects.
>> 2. People have aches, pains, and problems. They want relief, and if
>
>>they can get it from a pill, all the better. Much less work that way.
>> 3. Doctors are under pressure to fix people's aches, pains, and
>>problems, and if they can do it with a pill, all the better. Much less
>work
>>that way.
>>
>> See? It's a perfect kinky three-way relationship. No conspiracy,
just
>
>>people being their usual crazy selves.
>>
>> But if you're going to have this be a big conspiracy, you better include
>
>>the parents and teachers in on it. No one is forcing parents to drug their
>
>>kids. I had a problem child, and I didn't drug him. The school wanted
>us
>>to, and we said, "NO!" Children are all individual people who learn in
>>different ways and at different rates, and I'm not going to drug him just
>
>>because they can't figure how to teach him.
>>
>> Some shrinks drug their patients, others don't. I'm not buying the
>big
>>faceless EVIL. It's just the pharmaceutical-medical-patient triangle at
>
>>work.
>>
>> Many years ago, the American Psychiatric Association rejected and
>>criticized Dianetics/Scientology, and ever since then the Church of
>>Scientology has been following L. Ron's policy to attack the attackers,
>
>>rather than defend the Church. The entire profession of psychiatry became
>
>>"fair game." Is it possible that, as a loyal member of the COS, this
>>decades old conflict is an element of your passionate feelings about psychs?
>
>>Can you confront that possibility?
>>
>> I agree philosophically about the use of psychiatric drugs on children
>
>>(and adults for that matter), but broad generalities are just not at all
>
>>persuasive or helpful.
>>
>>Peace,
>>
>>Sarah(tonin re-uptake inhibitor)
>>
>>
>>"Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message news:478b7089@linux...
>>> Sarah, It's hard to confront evil. Sometimes evil people smile and laugh
>
>>> and seem like,they are your friend. But truly evil actions are not done
>by
>>> accident. Can you think of any word other than "evil" for drugging 8
>>> million helpless and innocent children with a harmful and very powerful
>
>>> narcotic? It is NO ACCIDENT and it is VERY EVIL.
>>>
>>> Confront it.
>>>
>>> Sarah wrote:
>>>> Now, settle down, Bill . . . don't go all Tom Cruise on us. "Battlefield
>
>>>> Earth" was just a book and a movie . . . the psych-iatrists/ologists
>are
>>>> not evil aliens from another galaxy . . . or ARE they? (dunt dunt
>>>> duuunnnnn . . . ) Psychs . . . Psychlos . . . hmmm.
>>>>
>>>> I admire that Scientology usually demands specifics and personal
>>>> observation, but when it comes to psychiatry, it's all broad
>>>> generalities. I know a fair number of psychs through my job, and if
>>>> there's an evil conspiracy to ruin humanity, I think someone forgot
to
>
>>>> clue them in. Now, the pharmaceutical companies . . . that's another
>
>>>> story.
>>>>
>>>> But thanks for the nice compliment. I should tell you, though, that
>I'm
>>>> not particularly young, and the fact that I can count spilled toothpicks
>
>>>> at a glance doesn't make me bright.
>>>>
>>>> I'm an excellent driver.
>>>>
>>>> S
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:478a535f$1@linux...
>>>>> Well done, class! Your answers are all correct, but as usual our bright
>
>>>>> young lady is most astute. In the '60s psychiatry started a campaign
>to
>>>>> influence the schools and school systems and the teaching colleges
in
>a
>>>>> big way.
>>>>>
>>>>> In the '50s at an annual convention, the head of American Psychiatric
>
>>>>> Association publicly declared their new goal of creating a "Value
>>>>> Neutral Society". Their aim was to blur and eradicate the distinction
>
>>>>> between right and wrong.
>>>>>
>>>>> They knew that the sure way to change society was by influencing the
>
>>>>> children. Psychiatrists have gradually introduced to our schools the
>
>>>>> mass drugging of children and even infants (approximately 8 million
>on
>>>>> Ritalin type drugs), Outcome Based Education (doesn't matter how much
>or
>>>>> how well children learn, just that they felt good about it) and the
>rest
>>>>> of their psuchobabble notions of how people should think and behave.
>>>>>
>>>>> Who was the most influential proponent of the "drug culture"? Not
>>>>> coincidentally, a psychologist and college professor, Dr. Timothy Leary.
>>>>>
>>>>> When you hear someone derided for being "judgmental", that is the
>>>>> influence of psychiatric double speak. Smart, ethical people used to
>be
>>>>> regarded as showing "good judgment", but now that positive attribute
>of
>>>>> being able to rightly judge people and situations has been slyly skewed
>
>>>>> into a bad thing. I'm sure you have noticed other examples of how
>>>>> illogical psychiatric concepts have replaced good reasoning.
>>>>>
>>>>> When you look around our society and see the delineation between right
>
>>>>> and wrong, logical and illogical, smart and stupid being blurred it
>is
>>>>> no accident. Look to the only group who has for over 50 years had that
>
>>>>> as their stated aim: psychiatry and psychology.
>>>>>
>>>>> We can fix our schools but we must first recognize the source of the
>
>>>>> problem and erase its influence or it will only get worse. Our children
>
>>>>> are our responsibility.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> rick wrote:
>>>>>> yup, a bunch of egotistical numbnuts. it astounds me the level of
>non
>>>>>> educated college graduates we're churning out...with pride.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sun, 13 Jan 2008 01:29:11 -0800, "Sarah" <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I think you got it, Don. Psychologists pretending to know something
>
>>>>>>> decided that discipline and competion were harmful to children's
>>>>>>> mental health.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> S
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:4789a15e$1@linux...
>>>>>>>> Self esteem replaced achievement.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>
>New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive. A bit
slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right now I need a
heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie rentals, a
wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for) yet. Dang! I
guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now and NAB, much
like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice or fanfare.
I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and chipset for
more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch track
pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.comOK!! OK!!!...I was just sayin' ;o), and actually I do agree with this (your)
post.
"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>In the case of selecting school standards it is essentially a democracy
>of the engaged. (that then has to play political football with the
>unengaged) In other words, the more you get involved the more say
>you have.
>
>Over the last few years, I have been involved in a couple of local committees
>both city and county, and two things have impressed me:
>
>It's actually quite easy to get involved and have your voice heard. (That
>
>doesn't mean anyone is listening of course...)
>
>Those people serving in these roles tend to be good folks and not
>ideologues.
>
>My point? Just as with school Science standards (and I am against the
>mandated teaching of either creationism or ID) those with a burden on
>the issue hold the conversation. There WILL be a conversation however,
>especially on the teaching of virtue to young people. Then, some
>consensus is formed, that hopefully will not upset either the militant
>secularists, nor the conservative theists too much (though neither
>side will get what they really want) and this is presented to the public
>and made into policy. Then the activists try to get "the bums" who
>passed this garbage all recalled and the policy nullified. They may succeed.
>If they do not, the policy stands. The one group that gets well and truly
>steamrollered are those who think the whole project is impossible.
>
>It's not. Consensus is achievable.
>
>And anyone who doesn't think that we have a real problem in
>our public schools is in deep denial.
>
>DC
>
>
>
>"Deej" <noway@jose.net> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>This country is still a democracy, no matter how much that pisses you
>>>off,
>>
>>errrrr..........just one small point. This country is not a democracy and
>>never has been. It is a representative republic with a bicameral legislature
>>which was specifically created to protect minority rights from the tyranny
>>majority rule, which is the essence of the definition of democracy. In
this
>>country, we do employ a democratic "method" wherein the those who are legally
>>entitled to vote (the electorate) choose legislators who are, in turn,
subject
>>to the rules as set out in the constitution and interpreted by the courts.
>>
>>
>>Just a small point........but perhaps important to some degree.
>>
>>;o)
>>
>>OK..now I'm gonna put on my flame suit and cover up.
>>
>>
>I'm looking for a new portable, and saw the hype on this. If I can put Debian
and XP on it I'd be sincerely interested, as long as the hardware specs aren't
too horrible and they don't have massive hardware issues out of the chute.
TCB
Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>
>New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
>The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive. A bit
>slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>
>It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right now I need a
>heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>
>Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie rentals, a
>wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>
>No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for) yet. Dang! I
>guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now and NAB, much
>like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice or fanfare.
>
>I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and chipset for
>more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch track
>pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
>
>Cheers,
> -Jamie
> www.JamieKrutz.comJamie - Sorry there weren't other new laptops - maybe soon.
Air looks interesting - big price difference between the PATA 1.7Ghz version
and the solid state 1.8 - $1799 to $3100 - ouch. I guess solid state
has a ways to go to be cost effective. 64G is a lot for solid state for
now.
In 10 years, we'll laugh at these early sizes as we buy 100TB solid state
laptops with touchscreens for $500. ;-) lol
Getting ready to pick up the iPod Touch update (yep, got one before
Christmas)
I'll let you know how it is - looks like some cool and much needed and
really nice additional apps!
Woohoo! Email on the iPod touch!
Dang - started the latest minor update (165M on DSL.... zzzz) before seeing
the new features update. It will be a while before I can buy and dl the new
major update.
Dedric
"Jamie K" <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote in message news:478d0542@linux...
>
> New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
> The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive. A bit slower
> CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>
> It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right now I need a
> heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>
> Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie rentals, a
> wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>
> No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for) yet. Dang! I guess
> they'll sneak that update in sometime between now and NAB, much like they
> did with the MacPro last week with little notice or fanfare.
>
> I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and chipset for
> more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch track pad!
> Hope it doesn't take months...
>
> Cheers,
> -Jamie
> www.JamieKrutz.comDedric Terry wrote:
> Jamie - Sorry there weren't other new laptops - maybe soon.
Yeah, bummer! But it'll happen. I can wait but hopefully it won't be too
long. I'd also like to see them make the hard drive user swappable so I
can easily add a solid state drive when the prices come down.
> Air looks interesting - big price difference between the PATA 1.7Ghz
> version
> and the solid state 1.8 - $1799 to $3100 - ouch. I guess solid state
> has a ways to go to be cost effective. 64G is a lot for solid state for
> now.
> In 10 years, we'll laugh at these early sizes as we buy 100TB solid
> state laptops with touchscreens for $500. ;-) lol
Yep. Or it'll all be wireless into our brains, no touchscreen needed. :^)
> Getting ready to pick up the iPod Touch update (yep, got one before
> Christmas)
> I'll let you know how it is - looks like some cool and much needed and
> really nice additional apps!
> Woohoo! Email on the iPod touch!
Yeah, and notes, too. The Touch is starting to look like a useful little
device. Should my Psion start getting nervous?
Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com
> Dang - started the latest minor update (165M on DSL.... zzzz) before
> seeing the new features update. It will be a while before I can buy and
> dl the new major update.
>
> Dedric
>
> "Jamie K" <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote in message news:478d0542@linux...
>>
>> New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
>> The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive. A bit
>> slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>>
>> It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right now I need a
>> heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>>
>> Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie rentals, a
>> wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>>
>> No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for) yet. Dang! I
>> guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now and NAB, much
>> like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice or fanfare.
>>
>> I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and chipset for
>> more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch track
>> pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
>>
>> Cheers,
>> -Jamie
>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>TCB wrote:
> I'm looking for a new portable, and saw the hype on this. If I can put Debian
> and XP on it I'd be sincerely interested, as long as the hardware specs aren't
> too horrible and they don't have massive hardware issues out of the chute.
HD is only 80GB (or 64GB if you want to spring for the solid state drive
option). If that's enough space to add Debial and XP, bootcamp should
support 'em. Or use one of the virtual machine setups if you want to
switch between OSs on the fly. CPU is 1.8GHZ I think. Slower than the
bigger/heavier laptops but still very capable.
Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com
> TCB
>
> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>> New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
>> The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive. A bit
>> slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>>
>> It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right now I need a
>> heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>>
>> Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie rentals, a
>> wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>>
>> No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for) yet. Dang! I
>> guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now and NAB, much
>> like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice or fanfare.
>>
>> I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and chipset for
>> more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch track
>> pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
>>
>> Cheers,
>> -Jamie
>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>Well, the update toasted my iPod Touch -- minor oversight on Apple's part:
Vista loses the iPod driver when iTunes tries to start the update process
and can't recover it/find it. It's toasted now - no OS - just keeps looking
for a recovery boot (there is no CDRom
to boot from). I'm off to CompUSA to hope they can fix it, otherwise, it's
dead and going back to Apple,
with a request for some freebies for this pos design.
On one of my WinXP PCs, it just bluescreens when trying to update the iPod
Touch. On the other, there is no driver for it
to find, and with no boot CD, it's history.
This laptop has pissed me off for the last time. It's getting reformated
with XP, or put on eBay. I'll probably
have to reload all of my CDs onto the iPod now....
Guess this is Apple's (yet again) way of crippling their software on PCs to
force people to buy Macs. What a joke.
Dedric
"Jamie K" <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote in message news:478d0fdc@linux...
> Dedric Terry wrote:
>> Jamie - Sorry there weren't other new laptops - maybe soon.
>
> Yeah, bummer! But it'll happen. I can wait but hopefully it won't be too
> long. I'd also like to see them make the hard drive user swappable so I
> can easily add a solid state drive when the prices come down.
>
>
>> Air looks interesting - big price difference between the PATA 1.7Ghz
>> version
>> and the solid state 1.8 - $1799 to $3100 - ouch. I guess solid state
>> has a ways to go to be cost effective. 64G is a lot for solid state for
>> now.
>> In 10 years, we'll laugh at these early sizes as we buy 100TB solid state
>> laptops with touchscreens for $500. ;-) lol
>
> Yep. Or it'll all be wireless into our brains, no touchscreen needed. :^)
>
>
>> Getting ready to pick up the iPod Touch update (yep, got one before
>> Christmas)
>> I'll let you know how it is - looks like some cool and much needed and
>> really nice additional apps!
>> Woohoo! Email on the iPod touch!
>
> Yeah, and notes, too. The Touch is starting to look like a useful little
> device. Should my Psion start getting nervous?
>
> Cheers,
> -Jamie
> www.JamieKrutz.com
>
>
>
>> Dang - started the latest minor update (165M on DSL.... zzzz) before
>> seeing the new features update. It will be a while before I can buy and
>> dl the new major update.
>>
>> Dedric
>>
>> "Jamie K" <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote in message news:478d0542@linux...
>>>
>>> New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
>>> The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive. A bit
>>> slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>>>
>>> It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right now I need a
>>> heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>>>
>>> Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie rentals, a
>>> wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>>>
>>> No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for) yet. Dang! I
>>> guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now and NAB, much
>>> like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice or fanfare.
>>>
>>> I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and chipset for
>>> more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch track
>>> pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> -Jamie
>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>Yikes! Good luck bringing the dead back to life!
My Psion just reminded me that it already has a solid state drive (16mb
internal plus compact flash that's currently at 128mb); that it has a
real keyboard and a touch screen; and that it doesn't blow up. But then
I asked where are its updates, wireless web browsing, and music and
movie playing. Then it said OK, right, fine, but it can record audio,
and the Psion calendar has a full year view.
So based that conversation, and your experience with the Touch update,
my Psion is safe...for now.
Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com
Dedric Terry wrote:
> Well, the update toasted my iPod Touch -- minor oversight on Apple's
> part: Vista loses the iPod driver when iTunes tries to start the update
> process and can't recover it/find it. It's toasted now - no OS - just
> keeps looking for a recovery boot (there is no CDRom
> to boot from). I'm off to CompUSA to hope they can fix it, otherwise,
> it's dead and going back to Apple,
> with a request for some freebies for this pos design.
>
> On one of my WinXP PCs, it just bluescreens when trying to update the
> iPod Touch. On the other, there is no driver for it
> to find, and with no boot CD, it's history.
>
> This laptop has pissed me off for the last time. It's getting
> reformated with XP, or put on eBay. I'll probably
> have to reload all of my CDs onto the iPod now....
>
> Guess this is Apple's (yet again) way of crippling their software on PCs
> to force people to buy Macs. What a joke.
>
> Dedric
>
> "Jamie K" <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote in message news:478d0fdc@linux...
>> Dedric Terry wrote:
>>> Jamie - Sorry there weren't other new laptops - maybe soon.
>>
>> Yeah, bummer! But it'll happen. I can wait but hopefully it won't be
>> too long. I'd also like to see them make the hard drive user swappable
>> so I can easily add a solid state drive when the prices come down.
>>
>>
>>> Air looks interesting - big price difference between the PATA 1.7Ghz
>>> version
>>> and the solid state 1.8 - $1799 to $3100 - ouch. I guess solid state
>>> has a ways to go to be cost effective. 64G is a lot for solid state
>>> for now.
>>> In 10 years, we'll laugh at these early sizes as we buy 100TB solid
>>> state laptops with touchscreens for $500. ;-) lol
>>
>> Yep. Or it'll all be wireless into our brains, no touchscreen needed. :^)
>>
>>
>>> Getting ready to pick up the iPod Touch update (yep, got one before
>>> Christmas)
>>> I'll let you know how it is - looks like some cool and much needed
>>> and really nice additional apps!
>>> Woohoo! Email on the iPod touch!
>>
>> Yeah, and notes, too. The Touch is starting to look like a useful
>> little device. Should my Psion start getting nervous?
>>
>> Cheers,
>> -Jamie
>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>
>>
>>
>>> Dang - started the latest minor update (165M on DSL.... zzzz) before
>>> seeing the new features update. It will be a while before I can buy
>>> and dl the new major update.
>>>
>>> Dedric
>>>
>>> "Jamie K" <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote in message news:478d0542@linux...
>>>>
>>>> New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
>>>> The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive. A bit
>>>> slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>>>>
>>>> It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right now I need
>>>> a heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>>>>
>>>> Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie rentals,
>>>> a wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>>>>
>>>> No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for) yet. Dang! I
>>>> guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now and NAB,
>>>> much like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice or
>>>> fanfare.
>>>>
>>>> I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and chipset
>>>> for more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch
>>>> track pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> -Jamie
>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>
>Odd. It's my understanding that 6% is about a third of what you'd get if you
calculated it the way it used to be calculated.
-steve
"Gary Flanigan" <garyf_94103@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>Where did you get that number? It is roughly twice what has been reporteed
>by any other source I have seen.
>
>
>Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>>To quote myself, "...our Fed Reserve just keeps on printing new dollars
>
>>every time they feel like having an extra juicy profit." Who gets rich
>>in war time? Central bankers! They love war time, lending money to both
>
>>sides at exorbitant interest rates.
>>
>>You do realize who gets screwed by inflation? People who work for a
>>living and people who save money. Do you still think we can afford this
>
>>war and our bought and paid for Presidents?
>>
>>Are you hearing Ron Paul yet?
>>
>>PS: Martin, I know this is OT and may not seem to apply to Australia,
>>but please don't ignore it. You will somehow feel the effects of it,
>>too. Sorry.
>Drive space isn't much of an issue, this would be mostly an office/travel
laptop, my music laptop is already tricked out with a 250GB drive. Also SSD
drives are just way to expensive now.
I'll keep an eye on this. If they don't have any of the usual dying batteries/cracking
cases problems that a lot of first gen Apple hardware has I'll give one a
serious look.
TCB
Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>TCB wrote:
>> I'm looking for a new portable, and saw the hype on this. If I can put
Debian
>> and XP on it I'd be sincerely interested, as long as the hardware specs
aren't
>> too horrible and they don't have massive hardware issues out of the chute.
>
>HD is only 80GB (or 64GB if you want to spring for the solid state drive
>option). If that's enough space to add Debial and XP, bootcamp should
>support 'em. Or use one of the virtual machine setups if you want to
>switch between OSs on the fly. CPU is 1.8GHZ I think. Slower than the
>bigger/heavier laptops but still very capable.
>
>Cheers,
> -Jamie
> www.JamieKrutz.com
>
>
>
>> TCB
>>
>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>> New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
>>> The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive. A bit
>>> slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>>>
>>> It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right now I need a
>>> heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>>>
>>> Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie rentals, a
>>> wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>>>
>>> No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for) yet. Dang! I
>>> guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now and NAB, much
>>> like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice or fanfare.
>>>
>>> I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and chipset for
>>> more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch track
>>> pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> -Jamie
>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>It was headline on Drudge
Gary Flanigan wrote:
> Where did you get that number? It is roughly twice what has been reporteed
> by any other source I have seen.
>
>
> Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>> To quote myself, "...our Fed Reserve just keeps on printing new dollars
>
>> every time they feel like having an extra juicy profit." Who gets rich
>> in war time? Central bankers! They love war time, lending money to both
>
>> sides at exorbitant interest rates.
>>
>> You do realize who gets screwed by inflation? People who work for a
>> living and people who save money. Do you still think we can afford this
>
>> war and our bought and paid for Presidents?
>>
>> Are you hearing Ron Paul yet?
>>
>> PS: Martin, I know this is OT and may not seem to apply to Australia,
>> but please don't ignore it. You will somehow feel the effects of it,
>> too. Sorry.
>Yikes squared. Apparently there is a bug either in the update process,
or it's Vista integration. No PC could find a driver for it to restore it.
I had to take it home and restore on our Mac. At first iTunes couldn't
find/connect to the backup/restore server (here's where I was really getting
angry). After about a dozen tries it finally found it.
It's reloading my songs now... so I'm back to work and let it do its' thing
alone, in the punishing loneliness of a computer desk - fitting punishment,
imho. The new apps will have to wait for another day - I'm also grounding
it for a week, and limiting it's YouTube privileges as well.
Really frustrating. Yep, your Psion is safe.
Dedric
On 1/15/08 1:31 PM, in article 478d1bbc@linux, "Jamie K"
<Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>
> Yikes! Good luck bringing the dead back to life!
>
> My Psion just reminded me that it already has a solid state drive (16mb
> internal plus compact flash that's currently at 128mb); that it has a
> real keyboard and a touch screen; and that it doesn't blow up. But then
> I asked where are its updates, wireless web browsing, and music and
> movie playing. Then it said OK, right, fine, but it can record audio,
> and the Psion calendar has a full year view.
>
> So based that conversation, and your experience with the Touch update,
> my Psion is safe...for now.
>
> Cheers,
> -Jamie
> www.JamieKrutz.com
>
>
>
>
> Dedric Terry wrote:
>> Well, the update toasted my iPod Touch -- minor oversight on Apple's
>> part: Vista loses the iPod driver when iTunes tries to start the update
>> process and can't recover it/find it. It's toasted now - no OS - just
>> keeps looking for a recovery boot (there is no CDRom
>> to boot from). I'm off to CompUSA to hope they can fix it, otherwise,
>> it's dead and going back to Apple,
>> with a request for some freebies for this pos design.
>>
>> On one of my WinXP PCs, it just bluescreens when trying to update the
>> iPod Touch. On the other, there is no driver for it
>> to find, and with no boot CD, it's history.
>>
>> This laptop has pissed me off for the last time. It's getting
>> reformated with XP, or put on eBay. I'll probably
>> have to reload all of my CDs onto the iPod now....
>>
>> Guess this is Apple's (yet again) way of crippling their software on PCs
>> to force people to buy Macs. What a joke.
>>
>> Dedric
>>
>> "Jamie K" <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote in message news:478d0fdc@linux...
>>> Dedric Terry wrote:
>>>> Jamie - Sorry there weren't other new laptops - maybe soon.
>>>
>>> Yeah, bummer! But it'll happen. I can wait but hopefully it won't be
>>> too long. I'd also like to see them make the hard drive user swappable
>>> so I can easily add a solid state drive when the prices come down.
>>>
>>>
>>>> Air looks interesting - big price difference between the PATA 1.7Ghz
>>>> version
>>>> and the solid state 1.8 - $1799 to $3100 - ouch. I guess solid state
>>>> has a ways to go to be cost effective. 64G is a lot for solid state
>>>> for now.
>>>> In 10 years, we'll laugh at these early sizes as we buy 100TB solid
>>>> state laptops with touchscreens for $500. ;-) lol
>>>
>>> Yep. Or it'll all be wireless into our brains, no touchscreen needed. :^)
>>>
>>>
>>>> Getting ready to pick up the iPod Touch update (yep, got one before
>>>> Christmas)
>>>> I'll let you know how it is - looks like some cool and much needed
>>>> and really nice additional apps!
>>>> Woohoo! Email on the iPod touch!
>>>
>>> Yeah, and notes, too. The Touch is starting to look like a useful
>>> little device. Should my Psion start getting nervous?
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> -Jamie
>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> Dang - started the latest minor update (165M on DSL.... zzzz) before
>>>> seeing the new features update. It will be a while before I can buy
>>>> and dl the new major update.
>>>>
>>>> Dedric
>>>>
>>>> "Jamie K" <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote in message news:478d0542@linux...
>>>>>
>>>>> New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
>>>>> The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive. A bit
>>>>> slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>>>>>
>>>>> It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right now I need
>>>>> a heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>>>>>
>>>>> Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie rentals,
>>>>> a wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>>>>>
>>>>> No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for) yet. Dang! I
>>>>> guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now and NAB,
>>>>> much like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice or
>>>>> fanfare.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and chipset
>>>>> for more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch
>>>>> track pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
>>>>>
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>
>>Never mind, I take it all back, it doesn't have ethernet. Nice job Apple,
leave out a ten cent part on an $1800 laptop so I can't use it in my office
to talk to my servers securely over a wire.
TCB
"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>
>Drive space isn't much of an issue, this would be mostly an office/travel
>laptop, my music laptop is already tricked out with a 250GB drive. Also
SSD
>drives are just way to expensive now.
>
>I'll keep an eye on this. If they don't have any of the usual dying batteries/cracking
>cases problems that a lot of first gen Apple hardware has I'll give one
a
>serious look.
>
>TCB
>
>Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>TCB wrote:
>>> I'm looking for a new portable, and saw the hype on this. If I can put
>Debian
>>> and XP on it I'd be sincerely interested, as long as the hardware specs
>aren't
>>> too horrible and they don't have massive hardware issues out of the chute.
>>
>>HD is only 80GB (or 64GB if you want to spring for the solid state drive
>
>>option). If that's enough space to add Debial and XP, bootcamp should
>>support 'em. Or use one of the virtual machine setups if you want to
>>switch between OSs on the fly. CPU is 1.8GHZ I think. Slower than the
>>bigger/heavier laptops but still very capable.
>>
>>Cheers,
>> -Jamie
>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>
>>
>>
>>> TCB
>>>
>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>> New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
>>>> The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive. A bit
>>>> slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>>>>
>>>> It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right now I need
a
>
>>>> heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>>>>
>>>> Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie rentals,
a
>
>>>> wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>>>>
>>>> No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for) yet. Dang! I
>
>>>> guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now and NAB, much
>
>>>> like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice or fanfare.
>>>>
>>>> I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and chipset for
>
>>>> more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch track
>
>>>> pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> -Jamie
>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>
>And they left out FireWire. WTF are they thinking??? But hey it's thin enough
to slice bread. What a joke!
"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>
>Never mind, I take it all back, it doesn't have ethernet. Nice job Apple,
>leave out a ten cent part on an $1800 laptop so I can't use it in my office
>to talk to my servers securely over a wire.
>
>TCB
>
>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>
>>Drive space isn't much of an issue, this would be mostly an office/travel
>>laptop, my music laptop is already tricked out with a 250GB drive. Also
>SSD
>>drives are just way to expensive now.
>>
>>I'll keep an eye on this. If they don't have any of the usual dying batteries/cracking
>>cases problems that a lot of first gen Apple hardware has I'll give one
>a
>>serious look.
>>
>>TCB
>>
>>Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>TCB wrote:
>>>> I'm looking for a new portable, and saw the hype on this. If I can put
>>Debian
>>>> and XP on it I'd be sincerely interested, as long as the hardware specs
>>aren't
>>>> too horrible and they don't have massive hardware issues out of the
chute.
>>>
>>>HD is only 80GB (or 64GB if you want to spring for the solid state drive
>>
>>>option). If that's enough space to add Debial and XP, bootcamp should
>>>support 'em. Or use one of the virtual machine setups if you want to
>>>switch between OSs on the fly. CPU is 1.8GHZ I think. Slower than the
>>>bigger/heavier laptops but still very capable.
>>>
>>>Cheers,
>>> -Jamie
>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> TCB
>>>>
>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>> New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
>>>>> The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive. A bit
>>>>> slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>>>>>
>>>>> It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right now I need
>a
>>
>>>>> heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>>>>>
>>>>> Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie rentals,
>a
>>
>>>>> wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>>>>>
>>>>> No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for) yet. Dang!
I
>>
>>>>> guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now and NAB, much
>>
>>>>> like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice or fanfare.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and chipset
for
>>
>>>>> more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch track
>>
>>>>> pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
>>>>>
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>
>>
>Sarah, In the '50s Hubbard approached psychiatrists and the APA to offer
them the techniques he had developed in Dianetics. He presented a decade
of clinical work and thousands of documented cases of dramatic
improvement and cures of people's mental aberrations. He was roundly
rejected. It wasn't just professional jealousy, they simply did not want
to know about cures or the betterment of man. Psychiatry has been trying
to suppress Scientology and Dianetics ever since. It did not take
Hubbard long to see where they were really coming from.
He wrote the book Dianetics and it has been a runaway best seller with
the public ever since. People want help, but psychiatry does not really
want to help them. They have used prefrontal lobotomy, insulin and
electric shock and mind-numbing drugs to subdue people, but no one gets
much better - they just get quieter and more apathetic. No one comes out
of a psychiatric session feeling like a million bucks, that's for sure.
On the other hand I come out of Scientology counseling sessions feeling
truly fantastic all the time. I sure wish everybody could feel that way.
By the way, it was you who named psychiatry as the cause of the decline
in the school systems.
Sarah wrote:
> Bill,
>
> I have no trouble "confronting" evil or anything else you want me to
> confront. I just don't like broad generalities, and you shouldn't either,
> since dealing in broad generalities is a characteristic Mr Hubbard has
> assigned to the antisocial personality.
>
> I think it works like this:
>
> 1. Drug companies make drugs. Sometimes they even make up diseases to
> market the drugs. (Restless leg syndrome? Please . . . ) Sometimes they
> even neglect to inform us about the risks and side effects.
> 2. People have aches, pains, and problems. They want relief, and if
> they can get it from a pill, all the better. Much less work that way.
> 3. Doctors are under pressure to fix people's aches, pains, and
> problems, and if they can do it with a pill, all the better. Much less work
> that way.
>
> See? It's a perfect kinky three-way relationship. No conspiracy, just
> people being their usual crazy selves.
>
> But if you're going to have this be a big conspiracy, you better include
> the parents and teachers in on it. No one is forcing parents to drug their
> kids. I had a problem child, and I didn't drug him. The school wanted us
> to, and we said, "NO!" Children are all individual people who learn in
> different ways and at different rates, and I'm not going to drug him just
> because they can't figure how to teach him.
>
> Some shrinks drug their patients, others don't. I'm not buying the big
> faceless EVIL. It's just the pharmaceutical-medical-patient triangle at
> work.
>
> Many years ago, the American Psychiatric Association rejected and
> criticized Dianetics/Scientology, and ever since then the Church of
> Scientology has been following L. Ron's policy to attack the attackers,
> rather than defend the Church. The entire profession of psychiatry became
> "fair game." Is it possible that, as a loyal member of the COS, this
> decades old conflict is an element of your passionate feelings about psychs?
> Can you confront that possibility?
>
> I agree philosophically about the use of psychiatric drugs on children
> (and adults for that matter), but broad generalities are just not at all
> persuasive or helpful.
>
> Peace,
>
> Sarah(tonin re-uptake inhibitor)
>
>
> "Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message news:478b7089@linux...
>> Sarah, It's hard to confront evil. Sometimes evil people smile and laugh
>> and seem like,they are your friend. But truly evil actions are not done by
>> accident. Can you think of any word other than "evil" for drugging 8
>> million helpless and innocent children with a harmful and very powerful
>> narcotic? It is NO ACCIDENT and it is VERY EVIL.
>>
>> Confront it.
>>
>> Sarah wrote:
>>> Now, settle down, Bill . . . don't go all Tom Cruise on us. "Battlefield
>>> Earth" was just a book and a movie . . . the psych-iatrists/ologists are
>>> not evil aliens from another galaxy . . . or ARE they? (dunt dunt
>>> duuunnnnn . . . ) Psychs . . . Psychlos . . . hmmm.
>>>
>>> I admire that Scientology usually demands specifics and personal
>>> observation, but when it comes to psychiatry, it's all broad
>>> generalities. I know a fair number of psychs through my job, and if
>>> there's an evil conspiracy to ruin humanity, I think someone forgot to
>>> clue them in. Now, the pharmaceutical companies . . . that's another
>>> story.
>>>
>>> But thanks for the nice compliment. I should tell you, though, that I'm
>>> not particularly young, and the fact that I can count spilled toothpicks
>>> at a glance doesn't make me bright.
>>>
>>> I'm an excellent driver.
>>>
>>> S
>>>
>>>
>>> "Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message
>>> news:478a535f$1@linux...
>>>> Well done, class! Your answers are all correct, but as usual our bright
>>>> young lady is most astute. In the '60s psychiatry started a campaign to
>>>> influence the schools and school systems and the teaching colleges in a
>>>> big way.
>>>>
>>>> In the '50s at an annual convention, the head of American Psychiatric
>>>> Association publicly declared their new goal of creating a "Value
>>>> Neutral Society". Their aim was to blur and eradicate the distinction
>>>> between right and wrong.
>>>>
>>>> They knew that the sure way to change society was by influencing the
>>>> children. Psychiatrists have gradually introduced to our schools the
>>>> mass drugging of children and even infants (approximately 8 million on
>>>> Ritalin type drugs), Outcome Based Education (doesn't matter how much or
>>>> how well children learn, just that they felt good about it) and the rest
>>>> of their psuchobabble notions of how people should think and behave.
>>>>
>>>> Who was the most influential proponent of the "drug culture"? Not
>>>> coincidentally, a psychologist and college professor, Dr. Timothy Leary.
>>>>
>>>> When you hear someone derided for being "judgmental", that is the
>>>> influence of psychiatric double speak. Smart, ethical people used to be
>>>> regarded as showing "good judgment", but now that positive attribute of
>>>> being able to rightly judge people and situations has been slyly skewed
>>>> into a bad thing. I'm sure you have noticed other examples of how
>>>> illogical psychiatric concepts have replaced good reasoning.
>>>>
>>>> When you look around our society and see the delineation between right
>>>> and wrong, logical and illogical, smart and stupid being blurred it is
>>>> no accident. Look to the only group who has for over 50 years had that
>>>> as their stated aim: psychiatry and psychology.
>>>>
>>>> We can fix our schools but we must first recognize the source of the
>>>> problem and erase its influence or it will only get worse. Our children
>>>> are our responsibility.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> rick wrote:
>>>>> yup, a bunch of egotistical numbnuts. it astounds me the level of non
>>>>> educated college graduates we're churning out...with pride.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, 13 Jan 2008 01:29:11 -0800, "Sarah" <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I think you got it, Don. Psychologists pretending to know something
>>>>>> decided that discipline and competion were harmful to children's
>>>>>> mental health.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> S
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:4789a15e$1@linux...
>>>>>>> Self esteem replaced achievement.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>Don't have coffee anywhere near your keyboard when you
watch this...
http://www.joecartoon.com/videos/661-spanish_for_your_nanny
DCWow, trying to make drugging a child seem as normal and helpful as
wearing glasses. That's a new low.
Gantt Kushner wrote:
> This has been an interesting thread for me. We just took Jacob, our 10 year
> old son, out of an expensive private school that we couldn't afford because
> he has a multitude of "learning disorders" that they weren't equipped to
> deal with. Our final decision (for now, at least) is to home school him
> (and possibly his little sister depending on how the financial aide negotiations
> go) but we did investigate our local public elementary school. We met with
> the principle who, upon hearing about Jake's LD issues, asked "well, is he
> on medication?". We explained about both his biological parents being alcoholic/drug
> addicts and our trepidation about putting a kid with such a high genetic
> predisposition for addiction on highly addictive drugs such as Ritalin (which
> we just thought was bad speed back in the day) or Adderall (which is just
> another name for Dexidrine, which was GOOD speed back in the day). Her response
> was to look at my wife and say "Well, you don't leave home without your glasses,
> do you?". Sorry. Wrong answer for us. I should also mention that this
> school is a double magnet school with high enough average test scores to
> qualify for two "resource" (special ed) teachers. For over 400 kids. Plus,
> the expensive testing that we had done to prove his special needs weren't
> isn't good enough for Montgomery County. If his teacher decides that he
> has problems they'll have the county people test him. Which means that he
> has to fail twice to get help - once in his old school and again in his new
> school.
>
> Anyway. I suppose I got off the topic! I must have needed to vent.
>
> Gantt
>
> "Sarah" <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com> wrote:
>> Bill,
>>
>> I have no trouble "confronting" evil or anything else you want me to
>
>> confront. I just don't like broad generalities, and you shouldn't either,
>
>> since dealing in broad generalities is a characteristic Mr Hubbard has
>> assigned to the antisocial personality.
>>
>> I think it works like this:
>>
>> 1. Drug companies make drugs. Sometimes they even make up diseases to
>
>> market the drugs. (Restless leg syndrome? Please . . . ) Sometimes they
>
>> even neglect to inform us about the risks and side effects.
>> 2. People have aches, pains, and problems. They want relief, and if
>
>> they can get it from a pill, all the better. Much less work that way.
>> 3. Doctors are under pressure to fix people's aches, pains, and
>> problems, and if they can do it with a pill, all the better. Much less
> work
>> that way.
>>
>> See? It's a perfect kinky three-way relationship. No conspiracy, just
>
|
|
|
|
| Re: Snow [message #93014 is a reply to message #92995] |
Sat, 24 November 2007 17:01 |
Sarah
Messages: 608
Registered: February 2007
|
Senior Member |
|
|
ugh my job, and if
>>>> there's an evil conspiracy to ruin humanity, I think someone forgot to
>
>>>> clue them in. Now, the pharmaceutical companies . . . that's another
>
>>>> story.
>>>>
>>>> But thanks for the nice compliment. I should tell you, though, that
> I'm
>>>> not particularly young, and the fact that I can count spilled toothpicks
>
>>>> at a glance doesn't make me bright.
>>>>
>>>> I'm an excellent driver.
>>>>
>>>> S
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:478a535f$1@linux...
>>>>> Well done, class! Your answers are all correct, but as usual our bright
>
>>>>> young lady is most astute. In the '60s psychiatry started a campaign
> to
>>>>> influence the schools and school systems and the teaching colleges in
> a
>>>>> big way.
>>>>>
>>>>> In the '50s at an annual convention, the head of American Psychiatric
>
>>>>> Association publicly declared their new goal of creating a "Value
>>>>> Neutral Society". Their aim was to blur and eradicate the distinction
>
>>>>> between right and wrong.
>>>>>
>>>>> They knew that the sure way to change society was by influencing the
>
>>>>> children. Psychiatrists have gradually introduced to our schools the
>
>>>>> mass drugging of children and even infants (approximately 8 million
> on
>>>>> Ritalin type drugs), Outcome Based Education (doesn't matter how much
> or
>>>>> how well children learn, just that they felt good about it) and the
> rest
>>>>> of their psuchobabble notions of how people should think and behave.
>>>>>
>>>>> Who was the most influential proponent of the "drug culture"? Not
>>>>> coincidentally, a psychologist and college professor, Dr. Timothy Leary.
>>>>>
>>>>> When you hear someone derided for being "judgmental", that is the
>>>>> influence of psychiatric double speak. Smart, ethical people used to
> be
>>>>> regarded as showing "good judgment", but now that positive attribute
> of
>>>>> being able to rightly judge people and situations has been slyly skewed
>
>>>>> into a bad thing. I'm sure you have noticed other examples of how
>>>>> illogical psychiatric concepts have replaced good reasoning.
>>>>>
>>>>> When you look around our society and see the delineation between right
>
>>>>> and wrong, logical and illogical, smart and stupid being blurred it
> is
>>>>> no accident. Look to the only group who has for over 50 years had that
>
>>>>> as their stated aim: psychiatry and psychology.
>>>>>
>>>>> We can fix our schools but we must first recognize the source of the
>
>>>>> problem and erase its influence or it will only get worse. Our children
>
>>>>> are our responsibility.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> rick wrote:
>>>>>> yup, a bunch of egotistical numbnuts. it astounds me the level of
> non
>>>>>> educated college graduates we're churning out...with pride.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sun, 13 Jan 2008 01:29:11 -0800, "Sarah" <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I think you got it, Don. Psychologists pretending to know something
>
>>>>>>> decided that discipline and competion were harmful to children's
>>>>>>> mental health.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> S
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message news:4789a15e$1@linux...
>>>>>>>> Self esteem replaced achievement.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>At the risk of being a pedant, 'inflation' means a lot of different things.
The most commonly quoted stat is the Consumer Price Index, which is a basket
of consumer goods that, mysteriously, doesn't include food or energy. There's
also the producer price index and about a half dozen others. The one Bill
was quoting, the 6.3 rate and highest since '81, was the wholesale inflation
rate.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=ajSM r9Idmokg&refer=home
Personally I think it's interesting that wholesale inflation is going up
so much faster than consumer inflation, which (sorry for the pedantry again)
I would guess is that fact that worldwide commodity prices have been going
through the roof but consumers are slowing down purchasing (no home equity
credit line to fund the Xmas orgy this year) so producers can't pass along
the extra cost to customers as price increases.
Keep in mind that the devaluing dollar is also in essence an inflationary
force. A weaker dollar means that when buying anything denominated in another
currency (unless that currency is pegged to the dollar), it costs more. And
if I need more dollars to buy the same thing, that's just another way to
say inflation.
Sliding even further into pedantry, inflation isn't necessarily, as Bill
claims, bad for 'the little guy.' Lenders fear inflation more than anything,
because if they charge a fixed interest rate and inflation is greater than
that they lose money. If a borrower's income keeps up with inflation (and
wages usually do, not always but usually) then the real cost of paying back
a loan is decreased by inflation. So banks, and central banks in particular,
fear inflation more than anything.
Anyway, it's not a simple, zero sum game, but Bill's stat was legit, and
referred to wholesale inflation.
Your friendly local off topic newsgroup pedant,
TCB
"Gary Flanigan" <garyf_94103@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>Where did you get that number? It is roughly twice what has been reporteed
>by any other source I have seen.
>
>
>Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>>To quote myself, "...our Fed Reserve just keeps on printing new dollars
>
>>every time they feel like having an extra juicy profit." Who gets rich
>>in war time? Central bankers! They love war time, lending money to both
>
>>sides at exorbitant interest rates.
>>
>>You do realize who gets screwed by inflation? People who work for a
>>living and people who save money. Do you still think we can afford this
>
>>war and our bought and paid for Presidents?
>>
>>Are you hearing Ron Paul yet?
>>
>>PS: Martin, I know this is OT and may not seem to apply to Australia,
>>but please don't ignore it. You will somehow feel the effects of it,
>>too. Sorry.
>Yeah, it's a lightened sub-notebook. No room for all that stuff. Great
for the market they're aiming it at, presumably. But not what I need
right now.
However the Air's optional external USB optical drive is interesting to
me. Maybe I could take the internal DVDR out of my next MacBook Pro
laptop and put in a second hard drive, that would be useful. And use the
external DVDR that was just announced today for few times I'd need it
with the laptop. Hmm.
Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com
James McCloskey wrote:
> And they left out FireWire. WTF are they thinking??? But hey it's thin enough
> to slice bread. What a joke!
>
> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>> Never mind, I take it all back, it doesn't have ethernet. Nice job Apple,
>> leave out a ten cent part on an $1800 laptop so I can't use it in my office
>> to talk to my servers securely over a wire.
>>
>> TCB
>>
>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>> Drive space isn't much of an issue, this would be mostly an office/travel
>>> laptop, my music laptop is already tricked out with a 250GB drive. Also
>> SSD
>>> drives are just way to expensive now.
>>>
>>> I'll keep an eye on this. If they don't have any of the usual dying batteries/cracking
>>> cases problems that a lot of first gen Apple hardware has I'll give one
>> a
>>> serious look.
>>>
>>> TCB
>>>
>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>> TCB wrote:
>>>>> I'm looking for a new portable, and saw the hype on this. If I can put
>>> Debian
>>>>> and XP on it I'd be sincerely interested, as long as the hardware specs
>>> aren't
>>>>> too horrible and they don't have massive hardware issues out of the
> chute.
>>>> HD is only 80GB (or 64GB if you want to spring for the solid state drive
>>>> option). If that's enough space to add Debial and XP, bootcamp should
>
>>>> support 'em. Or use one of the virtual machine setups if you want to
>>>> switch between OSs on the fly. CPU is 1.8GHZ I think. Slower than the
>
>>>> bigger/heavier laptops but still very capable.
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> -Jamie
>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> TCB
>>>>>
>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>> New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
>>>>>> The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive. A bit
>
>>>>>> slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right now I need
>> a
>>>>>> heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie rentals,
>> a
>>>>>> wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for) yet. Dang!
> I
>>>>>> guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now and NAB, much
>>>>>> like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice or fanfare.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and chipset
> for
>>>>>> more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch track
>>>>>> pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>Glad it came back to life! Grounding is fitting punishment, and I'd cut
off its allowance, too!
Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com
Dedric Terry wrote:
> Yikes squared. Apparently there is a bug either in the update process,
> or it's Vista integration. No PC could find a driver for it to restore it.
> I had to take it home and restore on our Mac. At first iTunes couldn't
> find/connect to the backup/restore server (here's where I was really getting
> angry). After about a dozen tries it finally found it.
>
> It's reloading my songs now... so I'm back to work and let it do its' thing
> alone, in the punishing loneliness of a computer desk - fitting punishment,
> imho. The new apps will have to wait for another day - I'm also grounding
> it for a week, and limiting it's YouTube privileges as well.
>
> Really frustrating. Yep, your Psion is safe.
>
> Dedric
>
> On 1/15/08 1:31 PM, in article 478d1bbc@linux, "Jamie K"
> <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>
>> Yikes! Good luck bringing the dead back to life!
>>
>> My Psion just reminded me that it already has a solid state drive (16mb
>> internal plus compact flash that's currently at 128mb); that it has a
>> real keyboard and a touch screen; and that it doesn't blow up. But then
>> I asked where are its updates, wireless web browsing, and music and
>> movie playing. Then it said OK, right, fine, but it can record audio,
>> and the Psion calendar has a full year view.
>>
>> So based that conversation, and your experience with the Touch update,
>> my Psion is safe...for now.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> -Jamie
>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Dedric Terry wrote:
>>> Well, the update toasted my iPod Touch -- minor oversight on Apple's
>>> part: Vista loses the iPod driver when iTunes tries to start the update
>>> process and can't recover it/find it. It's toasted now - no OS - just
>>> keeps looking for a recovery boot (there is no CDRom
>>> to boot from). I'm off to CompUSA to hope they can fix it, otherwise,
>>> it's dead and going back to Apple,
>>> with a request for some freebies for this pos design.
>>>
>>> On one of my WinXP PCs, it just bluescreens when trying to update the
>>> iPod Touch. On the other, there is no driver for it
>>> to find, and with no boot CD, it's history.
>>>
>>> This laptop has pissed me off for the last time. It's getting
>>> reformated with XP, or put on eBay. I'll probably
>>> have to reload all of my CDs onto the iPod now....
>>>
>>> Guess this is Apple's (yet again) way of crippling their software on PCs
>>> to force people to buy Macs. What a joke.
>>>
>>> Dedric
>>>
>>> "Jamie K" <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote in message news:478d0fdc@linux...
>>>> Dedric Terry wrote:
>>>>> Jamie - Sorry there weren't other new laptops - maybe soon.
>>>> Yeah, bummer! But it'll happen. I can wait but hopefully it won't be
>>>> too long. I'd also like to see them make the hard drive user swappable
>>>> so I can easily add a solid state drive when the prices come down.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Air looks interesting - big price difference between the PATA 1.7Ghz
>>>>> version
>>>>> and the solid state 1.8 - $1799 to $3100 - ouch. I guess solid state
>>>>> has a ways to go to be cost effective. 64G is a lot for solid state
>>>>> for now.
>>>>> In 10 years, we'll laugh at these early sizes as we buy 100TB solid
>>>>> state laptops with touchscreens for $500. ;-) lol
>>>> Yep. Or it'll all be wireless into our brains, no touchscreen needed. :^)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Getting ready to pick up the iPod Touch update (yep, got one before
>>>>> Christmas)
>>>>> I'll let you know how it is - looks like some cool and much needed
>>>>> and really nice additional apps!
>>>>> Woohoo! Email on the iPod touch!
>>>> Yeah, and notes, too. The Touch is starting to look like a useful
>>>> little device. Should my Psion start getting nervous?
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> -Jamie
>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Dang - started the latest minor update (165M on DSL.... zzzz) before
>>>>> seeing the new features update. It will be a while before I can buy
>>>>> and dl the new major update.
>>>>>
>>>>> Dedric
>>>>>
>>>>> "Jamie K" <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote in message news:478d0542@linux...
>>>>>> New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
>>>>>> The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive. A bit
>>>>>> slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right now I need
>>>>>> a heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie rentals,
>>>>>> a wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for) yet. Dang! I
>>>>>> guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now and NAB,
>>>>>> much like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice or
>>>>>> fanfare.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and chipset
>>>>>> for more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch
>>>>>> track pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>No firewire? Pretty much kills it for what a film producer
friend of mine was hoping - in-field video capture.
In a few years, most laptops will have solid state drives though. Someone
had to be the guinea pig and make a first one that few people would want.
Dedric
"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:478d2bf6$1@linux...
>
> And they left out FireWire. WTF are they thinking??? But hey it's thin
> enough
> to slice bread. What a joke!
>
> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>
>>Never mind, I take it all back, it doesn't have ethernet. Nice job Apple,
>>leave out a ten cent part on an $1800 laptop so I can't use it in my
>>office
>>to talk to my servers securely over a wire.
>>
>>TCB
>>
>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Drive space isn't much of an issue, this would be mostly an office/travel
>>>laptop, my music laptop is already tricked out with a 250GB drive. Also
>>SSD
>>>drives are just way to expensive now.
>>>
>>>I'll keep an eye on this. If they don't have any of the usual dying
>>>batteries/cracking
>>>cases problems that a lot of first gen Apple hardware has I'll give one
>>a
>>>serious look.
>>>
>>>TCB
>>>
>>>Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>TCB wrote:
>>>>> I'm looking for a new portable, and saw the hype on this. If I can put
>>>Debian
>>>>> and XP on it I'd be sincerely interested, as long as the hardware
>>>>> specs
>>>aren't
>>>>> too horrible and they don't have massive hardware issues out of the
> chute.
>>>>
>>>>HD is only 80GB (or 64GB if you want to spring for the solid state drive
>>>
>>>>option). If that's enough space to add Debial and XP, bootcamp should
>
>>>>support 'em. Or use one of the virtual machine setups if you want to
>>>>switch between OSs on the fly. CPU is 1.8GHZ I think. Slower than the
>
>>>>bigger/heavier laptops but still very capable.
>>>>
>>>>Cheers,
>>>> -Jamie
>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> TCB
>>>>>
>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>> New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
>>>>>> The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive. A bit
>
>>>>>> slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right now I need
>>a
>>>
>>>>>> heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie rentals,
>>a
>>>
>>>>>> wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for) yet. Dang!
> I
>>>
>>>>>> guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now and NAB, much
>>>
>>>>>> like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice or
>>>>>> fanfare.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and chipset
> for
>>>
>>>>>> more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch track
>>>
>>>>>> pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>
>>>
>>
>Don, thanks for the info.
In fact, this project is a DIY one and since it's the first time I do a thing
like that
it's a hell of an adventure. I'm sure the room will sound better than before.
Regards,
Ab
"Don Nafe" <dnafe@magma.ca> wrote:
>You can pretty well cut the cost by 2/3rds if you are able to do the DIY
>thing
>
>www.recording.org has a acoustics thread...check it out
>
>also John L. Sayers forum at http://www.johnlsayers.com/phpBB2/index.php
>
>Lot's of good ideas as well as experienced people to answer your questions
>
>As for software I used ETF 1.5 as well as a couple of others but
>unfortunately I lost them when my Laptop died
>
>Don
>
>
>"Ab" <ab.vangoor@wanadoo.fr> wrote in message news:478cba32$1@linux...
>>
>> Hi everybody,
>>
>> I'm redoing the acoustics of my room at home and I'm using suggestions
for
>> bass traps and absorbers from Ethan Winer
>> http://www.ethanwiner.com/acoustics.html
>>
>> What I would need now is a software (Mac) to measure the nasty ringing
>> frequencies
>> at a given spot so I can install absorbers and diffusers accurately.
>> I found this on the net
>> http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/25161& vid=470175&mode=info
>> Anyone familiar with this, or maybe other suggestions?
>> Any help in this domain is highly appreciated.
>>
>> Best regards,
>> Ab
>
>Actually, I did not name "psychiatry as the cause of the decline in the
school system," though you understandably heard it that way. I said, in
response to Don's comment about self-esteem vs achievement, that
"psychologists pretending to know something decided that discipline and
competion were harmful to children's mental health." Not an indictment of
the entire subject of psychology, just a group of individual psychologists
with some half-baked theories about children's education which unfortunately
had some influence on our schools.
I'd like to recommend everyone read my self-help books. I've written three
so far:
I'm OK, You're F***ed Up
Spanking the Child Within
Habits of the 7 Highly Effective People
Could change your life. :)
S
"Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message news:478d2d91$1@linux...
> Sarah, In the '50s Hubbard approached psychiatrists and the APA to offer
> them the techniques he had developed in Dianetics. He presented a decade
> of clinical work and thousands of documented cases of dramatic improvement
> and cures of people's mental aberrations. He was roundly rejected. It
> wasn't just professional jealousy, they simply did not want to know about
> cures or the betterment of man. Psychiatry has been trying to suppress
> Scientology and Dianetics ever since. It did not take Hubbard long to see
> where they were really coming from.
>
> He wrote the book Dianetics and it has been a runaway best seller with the
> public ever since. People want help, but psychiatry does not really want
> to help them. They have used prefrontal lobotomy, insulin and electric
> shock and mind-numbing drugs to subdue people, but no one gets much
> better - they just get quieter and more apathetic. No one comes out of a
> psychiatric session feeling like a million bucks, that's for sure.
>
> On the other hand I come out of Scientology counseling sessions feeling
> truly fantastic all the time. I sure wish everybody could feel that way.
>
> By the way, it was you who named psychiatry as the cause of the decline in
> the school systems.
>
> Sarah wrote:
>> Bill,
>>
>> I have no trouble "confronting" evil or anything else you want me to
>> confront. I just don't like broad generalities, and you shouldn't
>> either, since dealing in broad generalities is a characteristic Mr
>> Hubbard has assigned to the antisocial personality.
>>
>> I think it works like this:
>>
>> 1. Drug companies make drugs. Sometimes they even make up diseases to
>> market the drugs. (Restless leg syndrome? Please . . . ) Sometimes
>> they even neglect to inform us about the risks and side effects.
>> 2. People have aches, pains, and problems. They want relief, and if
>> they can get it from a pill, all the better. Much less work that way.
>> 3. Doctors are under pressure to fix people's aches, pains, and
>> problems, and if they can do it with a pill, all the better. Much less
>> work that way.
>>
>> See? It's a perfect kinky three-way relationship. No conspiracy,
>> just people being their usual crazy selves.
>>
>> But if you're going to have this be a big conspiracy, you better
>> include the parents and teachers in on it. No one is forcing parents to
>> drug their kids. I had a problem child, and I didn't drug him. The
>> school wanted us to, and we said, "NO!" Children are all individual
>> people who learn in different ways and at different rates, and I'm not
>> going to drug him just because they can't figure how to teach him.
>>
>> Some shrinks drug their patients, others don't. I'm not buying the
>> big faceless EVIL. It's just the pharmaceutical-medical-patient triangle
>> at work.
>>
>> Many years ago, the American Psychiatric Association rejected and
>> criticized Dianetics/Scientology, and ever since then the Church of
>> Scientology has been following L. Ron's policy to attack the attackers,
>> rather than defend the Church. The entire profession of psychiatry
>> became "fair game." Is it possible that, as a loyal member of the COS,
>> this decades old conflict is an element of your passionate feelings about
>> psychs? Can you confront that possibility?
>>
>> I agree philosophically about the use of psychiatric drugs on
>> children (and adults for that matter), but broad generalities are just
>> not at all persuasive or helpful.
>>
>> Peace,
>>
>> Sarah(tonin re-uptake inhibitor)
>>
>>
>> "Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message news:478b7089@linux...
>>> Sarah, It's hard to confront evil. Sometimes evil people smile and laugh
>>> and seem like,they are your friend. But truly evil actions are not done
>>> by accident. Can you think of any word other than "evil" for drugging 8
>>> million helpless and innocent children with a harmful and very powerful
>>> narcotic? It is NO ACCIDENT and it is VERY EVIL.
>>>
>>> Confront it.
>>>
>>> Sarah wrote:
>>>> Now, settle down, Bill . . . don't go all Tom Cruise on us.
>>>> "Battlefield Earth" was just a book and a movie . . . the
>>>> psych-iatrists/ologists are not evil aliens from another galaxy . . .
>>>> or ARE they? (dunt dunt duuunnnnn . . . ) Psychs . . . Psychlos . .
>>>> . hmmm.
>>>>
>>>> I admire that Scientology usually demands specifics and personal
>>>> observation, but when it comes to psychiatry, it's all broad
>>>> generalities. I know a fair number of psychs through my job, and if
>>>> there's an evil conspiracy to ruin humanity, I think someone forgot to
>>>> clue them in. Now, the pharmaceutical companies . . . that's another
>>>> story.
>>>>
>>>> But thanks for the nice compliment. I should tell you, though, that
>>>> I'm not particularly young, and the fact that I can count spilled
>>>> toothpicks at a glance doesn't make me bright.
>>>>
>>>> I'm an excellent driver.
>>>>
>>>> S
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message
>>>> news:478a535f$1@linux...
>>>>> Well done, class! Your answers are all correct, but as usual our
>>>>> bright young lady is most astute. In the '60s psychiatry started a
>>>>> campaign to influence the schools and school systems and the teaching
>>>>> colleges in a big way.
>>>>>
>>>>> In the '50s at an annual convention, the head of American Psychiatric
>>>>> Association publicly declared their new goal of creating a "Value
>>>>> Neutral Society". Their aim was to blur and eradicate the distinction
>>>>> between right and wrong.
>>>>>
>>>>> They knew that the sure way to change society was by influencing the
>>>>> children. Psychiatrists have gradually introduced to our schools the
>>>>> mass drugging of children and even infants (approximately 8 million on
>>>>> Ritalin type drugs), Outcome Based Education (doesn't matter how much
>>>>> or how well children learn, just that they felt good about it) and the
>>>>> rest of their psuchobabble notions of how people should think and
>>>>> behave.
>>>>>
>>>>> Who was the most influential proponent of the "drug culture"? Not
>>>>> coincidentally, a psychologist and college professor, Dr. Timothy
>>>>> Leary.
>>>>>
>>>>> When you hear someone derided for being "judgmental", that is the
>>>>> influence of psychiatric double speak. Smart, ethical people used to
>>>>> be regarded as showing "good judgment", but now that positive
>>>>> attribute of being able to rightly judge people and situations has
>>>>> been slyly skewed into a bad thing. I'm sure you have noticed other
>>>>> examples of how illogical psychiatric concepts have replaced good
>>>>> reasoning.
>>>>>
>>>>> When you look around our society and see the delineation between right
>>>>> and wrong, logical and illogical, smart and stupid being blurred it is
>>>>> no accident. Look to the only group who has for over 50 years had that
>>>>> as their stated aim: psychiatry and psychology.
>>>>>
>>>>> We can fix our schools but we must first recognize the source of the
>>>>> problem and erase its influence or it will only get worse. Our
>>>>> children are our responsibility.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> rick wrote:
>>>>>> yup, a bunch of egotistical numbnuts. it astounds me the level of
>>>>>> non
>>>>>> educated college graduates we're churning out...with pride.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sun, 13 Jan 2008 01:29:11 -0800, "Sarah"
>>>>>> <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I think you got it, Don. Psychologists pretending to know something
>>>>>>> decided that discipline and competion were harmful to children's
>>>>>>> mental health.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> S
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>> news:4789a15e$1@linux...
>>>>>>>> Self esteem replaced achievement.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>Bill L <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote:
>Psychiatry has been trying
>to suppress Scientology and Dianetics ever since. It did not take
>Hubbard long to see where they were really coming from.
I think they're coming from the standpoint of "space aliens?
Really?" I mean, Bill - how can one say this without offending
you, but come on, the guy built his own religion around an
unsold movie script. He was a science fiction writer & he
wrote a sci-fi story & turned it into a business that made him
hella more money than any series of movie deals could've gotten
him.
>He wrote the book Dianetics and it has been a runaway best seller with
>the public ever since.
"Journey to Ixtlan" was a runaway bestseller too, would you
yourself advocate the particular religious experiences outlined
in that book?
>On the other hand I come out of Scientology counseling sessions feeling
>truly fantastic all the time. I sure wish everybody could feel that way.
Lots of people of varying faiths can make similar claims, but it
doesn't mean they're right, either. If it works for you,
good for you, just don't try & pass it off as though it's the only thing
that works. If a catholic did that here, they'd get
lambasted.
TomThis is a multi-part message in MIME format.
---=_linux478d6237
Content-Type: text/plain
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Hey! Tom Cruise is a friend of mine! I worked with Tom Cruise!
YOU sir are NO Tom Cruise!
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dqhlAHOKLjI6KKKYBRRRQB//2Q==
---=_linux478d6237--Stephen Covey is fantastic.. I'll definitely recommend the 7 habits.
Life altering and eye opening doesn't adequately cover it, but it's the
closest I can get in text.
AA
"Sarah" <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com> wrote in message news:478d5ccf@linux...
> Actually, I did not name "psychiatry as the cause of the decline in the
> school system," though you understandably heard it that way. I said, in
> response to Don's comment about self-esteem vs achievement, that
> "psychologists pretending to know something decided that discipline and
> competion were harmful to children's mental health." Not an indictment of
> the entire subject of psychology, just a group of individual psychologists
> with some half-baked theories about children's education which
> unfortunately had some influence on our schools.
>
> I'd like to recommend everyone read my self-help books. I've written
> three so far:
> I'm OK, You're F***ed Up
> Spanking the Child Within
> Habits of the 7 Highly Effective People
>
> Could change your life. :)
>
> S
>
>
>
> "Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message
> news:478d2d91$1@linux...
>> Sarah, In the '50s Hubbard approached psychiatrists and the APA to offer
>> them the techniques he had developed in Dianetics. He presented a decade
>> of clinical work and thousands of documented cases of dramatic
>> improvement and cures of people's mental aberrations. He was roundly
>> rejected. It wasn't just professional jealousy, they simply did not want
>> to know about cures or the betterment of man. Psychiatry has been trying
>> to suppress Scientology and Dianetics ever since. It did not take Hubbard
>> long to see where they were really coming from.
>>
>> He wrote the book Dianetics and it has been a runaway best seller with
>> the public ever since. People want help, but psychiatry does not really
>> want to help them. They have used prefrontal lobotomy, insulin and
>> electric shock and mind-numbing drugs to subdue people, but no one gets
>> much better - they just get quieter and more apathetic. No one comes out
>> of a psychiatric session feeling like a million bucks, that's for sure.
>>
>> On the other hand I come out of Scientology counseling sessions feeling
>> truly fantastic all the time. I sure wish everybody could feel that way.
>>
>> By the way, it was you who named psychiatry as the cause of the decline
>> in the school systems.
>>
>> Sarah wrote:
>>> Bill,
>>>
>>> I have no trouble "confronting" evil or anything else you want me to
>>> confront. I just don't like broad generalities, and you shouldn't
>>> either, since dealing in broad generalities is a characteristic Mr
>>> Hubbard has assigned to the antisocial personality.
>>>
>>> I think it works like this:
>>>
>>> 1. Drug companies make drugs. Sometimes they even make up diseases
>>> to market the drugs. (Restless leg syndrome? Please . . . ) Sometimes
>>> they even neglect to inform us about the risks and side effects.
>>> 2. People have aches, pains, and problems. They want relief, and if
>>> they can get it from a pill, all the better. Much less work that way.
>>> 3. Doctors are under pressure to fix people's aches, pains, and
>>> problems, and if they can do it with a pill, all the better. Much less
>>> work that way.
>>>
>>> See? It's a perfect kinky three-way relationship. No conspiracy,
>>> just people being their usual crazy selves.
>>>
>>> But if you're going to have this be a big conspiracy, you better
>>> include the parents and teachers in on it. No one is forcing parents to
>>> drug their kids. I had a problem child, and I didn't drug him. The
>>> school wanted us to, and we said, "NO!" Children are all individual
>>> people who learn in different ways and at different rates, and I'm not
>>> going to drug him just because they can't figure how to teach him.
>>>
>>> Some shrinks drug their patients, others don't. I'm not buying the
>>> big faceless EVIL. It's just the pharmaceutical-medical-patient
>>> triangle at work.
>>>
>>> Many years ago, the American Psychiatric Association rejected and
>>> criticized Dianetics/Scientology, and ever since then the Church of
>>> Scientology has been following L. Ron's policy to attack the attackers,
>>> rather than defend the Church. The entire profession of psychiatry
>>> became "fair game." Is it possible that, as a loyal member of the COS,
>>> this decades old conflict is an element of your passionate feelings
>>> about psychs? Can you confront that possibility?
>>>
>>> I agree philosophically about the use of psychiatric drugs on
>>> children (and adults for that matter), but broad generalities are just
>>> not at all persuasive or helpful.
>>>
>>> Peace,
>>>
>>> Sarah(tonin re-uptake inhibitor)
>>>
>>>
>>> "Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message
>>> news:478b7089@linux...
>>>> Sarah, It's hard to confront evil. Sometimes evil people smile and
>>>> laugh and seem like,they are your friend. But truly evil actions are
>>>> not done by accident. Can you think of any word other than "evil" for
>>>> drugging 8 million helpless and innocent children with a harmful and
>>>> very powerful narcotic? It is NO ACCIDENT and it is VERY EVIL.
>>>>
>>>> Confront it.
>>>>
>>>> Sarah wrote:
>>>>> Now, settle down, Bill . . . don't go all Tom Cruise on us.
>>>>> "Battlefield Earth" was just a book and a movie . . . the
>>>>> psych-iatrists/ologists are not evil aliens from another galaxy . . .
>>>>> or ARE they? (dunt dunt duuunnnnn . . . ) Psychs . . . Psychlos . .
>>>>> . hmmm.
>>>>>
>>>>> I admire that Scientology usually demands specifics and personal
>>>>> observation, but when it comes to psychiatry, it's all broad
>>>>> generalities. I know a fair number of psychs through my job, and if
>>>>> there's an evil conspiracy to ruin humanity, I think someone forgot to
>>>>> clue them in. Now, the pharmaceutical companies . . . that's another
>>>>> story.
>>>>>
>>>>> But thanks for the nice compliment. I should tell you, though, that
>>>>> I'm not particularly young, and the fact that I can count spilled
>>>>> toothpicks at a glance doesn't make me bright.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm an excellent driver.
>>>>>
>>>>> S
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "Bill L" <bill@billlorentzen.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:478a535f$1@linux...
>>>>>> Well done, class! Your answers are all correct, but as usual our
>>>>>> bright young lady is most astute. In the '60s psychiatry started a
>>>>>> campaign to influence the schools and school systems and the teaching
>>>>>> colleges in a big way.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In the '50s at an annual convention, the head of American Psychiatric
>>>>>> Association publicly declared their new goal of creating a "Value
>>>>>> Neutral Society". Their aim was to blur and eradicate the distinction
>>>>>> between right and wrong.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> They knew that the sure way to change society was by influencing the
>>>>>> children. Psychiatrists have gradually introduced to our schools the
>>>>>> mass drugging of children and even infants (approximately 8 million
>>>>>> on Ritalin type drugs), Outcome Based Education (doesn't matter how
>>>>>> much or how well children learn, just that they felt good about it)
>>>>>> and the rest of their psuchobabble notions of how people should think
>>>>>> and behave.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Who was the most influential proponent of the "drug culture"? Not
>>>>>> coincidentally, a psychologist and college professor, Dr. Timothy
>>>>>> Leary.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> When you hear someone derided for being "judgmental", that is the
>>>>>> influence of psychiatric double speak. Smart, ethical people used to
>>>>>> be regarded as showing "good judgment", but now that positive
>>>>>> attribute of being able to rightly judge people and situations has
>>>>>> been slyly skewed into a bad thing. I'm sure you have noticed other
>>>>>> examples of how illogical psychiatric concepts have replaced good
>>>>>> reasoning.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> When you look around our society and see the delineation between
>>>>>> right and wrong, logical and illogical, smart and stupid being
>>>>>> blurred it is no accident. Look to the only group who has for over 50
>>>>>> years had that as their stated aim: psychiatry and psychology.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We can fix our schools but we must first recognize the source of the
>>>>>> problem and erase its influence or it will only get worse. Our
>>>>>> children are our responsibility.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> rick wrote:
>>>>>>> yup, a bunch of egotistical numbnuts. it astounds me the level of
>>>>>>> non
>>>>>>> educated college graduates we're churning out...with pride.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Sun, 13 Jan 2008 01:29:11 -0800, "Sarah"
>>>>>>> <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I think you got it, Don. Psychologists pretending to know
>>>>>>>> something decided that discipline and competion were harmful to
>>>>>>>> children's mental health.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> S
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>> news:4789a15e$1@linux...
>>>>>>>>> Self esteem replaced achievement.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>
>
>I've been using the UAD Plate 140 for a while now, and today I tried it on
Acoustic Guitar..for fun, but I'm finding it seems to have some phase cancellation
at 1536 sample nudge (4X100 slip)..Is this an incorrect value? It was easier
to hear on acoustic (drop d tuning) than on the lead vocals, I'm guessing
due to the more low end content is the reasonNo, i'm not Tom Cruise - i'm just posting anonymously because
I'm afraid of the Scientology death squads coming to get me
since i'm disagreeing with Bill.
Tom (or not Tom)
"John Travolta" <John@nowayjose.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>Hey! Tom Cruise is a friend of mine! I worked with Tom Cruise!
>
>YOU sir are NO Tom Cruise!
>
>
>"Sarah" <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com> wrote:
>I'd like to recommend everyone read my self-help books. I've written three
>so far:
> I'm OK, You're F***ed Up
> Spanking the Child Within
> Habits of the 7 Highly Effective People
>
>Could change your life. :)
>
>S
(sigh)......I'm gonna have to buy a new keyoard....grape juice this time......it
was worth it. thanks.
;o)"John Travolta" <John@nowayjose.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>Hey! Tom Cruise is a friend of mine! I worked with Tom Cruise!
>
>YOU sir are NO Tom Cruise!
>
I really think this is incredibly disrespectful of someone who I happen
to like a whole lot so I've gotta' speak up here. whoever you are, if you've
got some problem with someone's belief system and are compelled to slag them,
then at least have the integrity to show your own face as well.
Not cool.Hey, let's go on People's Court! You could sue me for mental anguish and
the price of a new keyboard.
'Course it's ten minutes to Wapner,
S
"Deej" <noway@jose.net> wrote in message news:478da4a6$1@linux...
>
> "Sarah" <sarahjane@sarahtonin.com> wrote:
>>I'd like to recommend everyone read my self-help books. I've written
>>three
>
>>so far:
>> I'm OK, You're F***ed Up
>> Spanking the Child Within
>> Habits of the 7 Highly Effective People
>>
>>Could change your life. :)
>>
>>S
>
> (sigh)......I'm gonna have to buy a new keyoard....grape juice this
> time......it
> was worth it. thanks.
>
> ;o)"DC" <dc@spammersinhell.com> wrote:
>
>Don't have coffee anywhere near your keyboard when you
>watch this...
>
>http://www.joecartoon.com/videos/661-spanish_for_your_nanny
>
>
>DC
Heheh!!!....brilliant!!!!....did you watch the one with the snake???.....I
know...I'm a total pig.....gawd I laughed so hard I woke up the dogs."Deej" <noway@jose.net> wrote:
>
>"John Travolta" <John@nowayjose.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>Hey! Tom Cruise is a friend of mine! I worked with Tom Cruise!
>>
>>YOU sir are NO Tom Cruise!
>>
> I really think this is incredibly disrespectful of someone who I happen
>to like a whole lot so I've gotta' speak up here. whoever you are, if you've
>got some problem with someone's belief system and are compelled to slag
them,
>then at least have the integrity to show your own face as well.
I happen to like & respect Bill a lot, as a person, and a
musician, and I am not trying to slag him - only disagree with
him. Problem is, you can't disagree with a Scientologist in
public without their death squads hunting you down, so this is
the only reason i am posting anonymously, which is probably at
least part of the reason NO ONE has ever disagreed with him on
this forum, ever.
Hopefully they can't get my ISP info from these posts,
otherwise i'm screwed.
Tom (Cruise/not Cruise)
>Not cool.
It's cool, really. Someone's got to do it.it's not about functionality, it's the ultimate ipod.
On Tue, 15 Jan 2008 15:57:39 -0700, "Dedric Terry" <dterry@keyofd.net>
wrote:
>No firewire? Pretty much kills it for what a film producer
>friend of mine was hoping - in-field video capture.
>
>In a few years, most laptops will have solid state drives though. Someone
>had to be the guinea pig and make a first one that few people would want.
>
>Dedric
>
>"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:478d2bf6$1@linux...
>>
>> And they left out FireWire. WTF are they thinking??? But hey it's thin
>> enough
>> to slice bread. What a joke!
>>
>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Never mind, I take it all back, it doesn't have ethernet. Nice job Apple,
>>>leave out a ten cent part on an $1800 laptop so I can't use it in my
>>>office
>>>to talk to my servers securely over a wire.
>>>
>>>TCB
>>>
>>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>Drive space isn't much of an issue, this would be mostly an office/travel
>>>>laptop, my music laptop is already tricked out with a 250GB drive. Also
>>>SSD
>>>>drives are just way to expensive now.
>>>>
>>>>I'll keep an eye on this. If they don't have any of the usual dying
>>>>batteries/cracking
>>>>cases problems that a lot of first gen Apple hardware has I'll give one
>>>a
>>>>serious look.
>>>>
>>>>TCB
>>>>
>>>>Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>TCB wrote:
>>>>>> I'm looking for a new portable, and saw the hype on this. If I can put
>>>>Debian
>>>>>> and XP on it I'd be sincerely interested, as long as the hardware
>>>>>> specs
>>>>aren't
>>>>>> too horrible and they don't have massive hardware issues out of the
>> chute.
>>>>>
>>>>>HD is only 80GB (or 64GB if you want to spring for the solid state drive
>>>>
>>>>>option). If that's enough space to add Debial and XP, bootcamp should
>>
>>>>>support 'em. Or use one of the virtual machine setups if you want to
>>>>>switch between OSs on the fly. CPU is 1.8GHZ I think. Slower than the
>>
>>>>>bigger/heavier laptops but still very capable.
>>>>>
>>>>>Cheers,
>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
>>>>>>> The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive. A bit
>>
>>>>>>> slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right now I need
>>>a
>>>>
>>>>>>> heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie rentals,
>>>a
>>>>
>>>>>>> wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for) yet. Dang!
>> I
>>>>
>>>>>>> guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now and NAB, much
>>>>
>>>>>>> like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice or
>>>>>>> fanfare.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and chipset
>> for
>>>>
>>>>>>> more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch track
>>>>
>>>>>>> pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>C -
Put it on a track insert next to a duplicate track and set it to 100%
dry. Should be very easy to tell aurally, but yo can also render the effected
track and look at the wave forms. Then, start planning your Super Bowl party.
-P
"CUjo" <chris@applemanstudio.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>I've been using the UAD Plate 140 for a while now, and today I tried it
on
>Acoustic Guitar..for fun, but I'm finding it seems to have some phase cancellation
>at 1536 sample nudge (4X100 slip)..Is this an incorrect value? It was easier
>to hear on acoustic (drop d tuning) than on the lead vocals, I'm guessing
>due to the more low end content is the reasonI cut my recording teeth on 140's and we were always
putting a delay in front of them to separate them from
the original signal, so unless I am misunderstanding
something, time alignment should be no problem.
"Phil Aiken" <adfadfa@asdfa.asdaf> wrote:
>
>C -
> Put it on a track insert next to a duplicate track and set it to 100%
>dry. Should be very easy to tell aurally, but yo can also render the effected
>track and look at the wave forms. Then, start planning your Super Bowl party.
> -P
>
>"CUjo" <chris@applemanstudio.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>I've been using the UAD Plate 140 for a while now, and today I tried it
>on
>>Acoustic Guitar..for fun, but I'm finding it seems to have some phase cancellation
>>at 1536 sample nudge (4X100 slip)..Is this an incorrect value? It was easier
>>to hear on acoustic (drop d tuning) than on the lead vocals, I'm guessing
>>due to the more low end content is the reason
>Here's an interesting video about psychiatry:
http://www.associatedcontent.com/video/976/psychiatry_no_sci ence_no_cures.html
Tom wrote:
> "Deej" <noway@jose.net> wrote:
>> "John Travolta" <John@nowayjose.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Hey! Tom Cruise is a friend of mine! I worked with Tom Cruise!
>>>
>>> YOU sir are NO Tom Cruise!
>>>
>> I really think this is incredibly disrespectful of someone who I happen
>> to like a whole lot so I've gotta' speak up here. whoever you are, if you've
>> got some problem with someone's belief system and are compelled to slag
> them,
>> then at least have the integrity to show your own face as well.
>
> I happen to like & respect Bill a lot, as a person, and a
> musician, and I am not trying to slag him - only disagree with
> him. Problem is, you can't disagree with a Scientologist in
> public without their death squads hunting you down, so this is
> the only reason i am posting anonymously, which is probably at
> least part of the reason NO ONE has ever disagreed with him on
> this forum, ever.
>
> Hopefully they can't get my ISP info from these posts,
> otherwise i'm screwed.
>
> Tom (Cruise/not Cruise)
>
>> Not cool.
>
> It's cool, really. Someone's got to do it.
>Check out Craig Anderton's new room tuning software package..this month's EQ
magazine...very cool...not sure of the price...
"Ab" <ab.vangoor@wanadoo.fr> wrote in message news:478cf89c$1@linux...
>
> I agree, I use MH interfaces all the time but hoped to get along with a
less
>
> pricier software for my needs. Thanks anyway.
>
> Regards
> Ab
>
> "tonehouse" <zmcleod@comcast.net> wrote:
> >SpectraFoo is great if you want to spen the money.....
> >"Ab" <ab.vangoor@wanadoo.fr> wrote in message news:478cba32$1@linux...
> >>
> >> Hi everybody,
> >>
> >> I'm redoing the acoustics of my room at home and I'm using suggestions
> for
> >> bass traps and absorbers from Ethan Winer
> >http://www.ethanwiner.com/acoustics.html
> >>
> >> What I would need now is a software (Mac) to measure the nasty ringing
> >frequencies
> >> at a given spot so I can install absorbers and diffusers accurately.
> >> I found this on the net
>
> http://www.versiontracker.com/dyn/moreinfo/macosx/25161& vid=470175&mode=inf
o
> >> Anyone familiar with this, or maybe other suggestions?
> >> Any help in this domain is highly appreciated.
> >>
> >> Best regards,
> >> Ab
> >
> >
>Are you going to come up?
"Phil Aiken" <adfadfa@asdfa.asdaf> wrote:
>
>C -
> Put it on a track insert next to a duplicate track and set it to 100%
>dry. Should be very easy to tell aurally, but yo can also render the effected
>track and look at the wave forms. Then, start planning your Super Bowl party.
> -P
>
>"CUjo" <chris@applemanstudio.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>I've been using the UAD Plate 140 for a while now, and today I tried it
>on
>>Acoustic Guitar..for fun, but I'm finding it seems to have some phase cancellation
>>at 1536 sample nudge (4X100 slip)..Is this an incorrect value? It was easier
>>to hear on acoustic (drop d tuning) than on the lead vocals, I'm guessing
>>due to the more low end content is the reason
>On the UAD EMT, there is a pre-delay knob, I always use a bit.
Actually this could be tru when using a real EMT I suppose.
When I was at Paul Kolderies studio a few years back (Phil was there) I brought
my Roland 501 and we used it on vocals, we noticed that depending on the
input chosen, there would be cancellation.
"John Macy" <nospamjohn@johnmacy.com> wrote:
>
>I cut my recording teeth on 140's and we were always
>putting a delay in front of them to separate them from
>the original signal, so unless I am misunderstanding
>something, time alignment should be no problem.
>
>
>
>"Phil Aiken" <adfadfa@asdfa.asdaf> wrote:
>>
>>C -
>> Put it on a track insert next to a duplicate track and set it to
100%
>>dry. Should be very easy to tell aurally, but yo can also render the effected
>>track and look at the wave forms. Then, start planning your Super Bowl
party.
>> -P
>>
>>"CUjo" <chris@applemanstudio.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>I've been using the UAD Plate 140 for a while now, and today I tried it
>>on
>>>Acoustic Guitar..for fun, but I'm finding it seems to have some phase
cancellation
>>>at 1536 sample nudge (4X100 slip)..Is this an incorrect value? It was
easier
>>>to hear on acoustic (drop d tuning) than on the lead vocals, I'm guessing
>>>due to the more low end content is the reason
>>
>Jamie,
There's plenty of room for FW and ethernet, and those should not be considered
luxury items. They're necessities on any computer these days. Why apple didn't
include them is beyond me.
TCB
Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>
>Yeah, it's a lightened sub-notebook. No room for all that stuff. Great
>for the market they're aiming it at, presumably. But not what I need
>right now.
>
>However the Air's optional external USB optical drive is interesting to
>me. Maybe I could take the internal DVDR out of my next MacBook Pro
>laptop and put in a second hard drive, that would be useful. And use the
>external DVDR that was just announced today for few times I'd need it
>with the laptop. Hmm.
>
>Cheers,
> -Jamie
> www.JamieKrutz.com
>
>
>
>James McCloskey wrote:
>> And they left out FireWire. WTF are they thinking??? But hey it's thin
enough
>> to slice bread. What a joke!
>>
>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>> Never mind, I take it all back, it doesn't have ethernet. Nice job Apple,
>>> leave out a ten cent part on an $1800 laptop so I can't use it in my
office
>>> to talk to my servers securely over a wire.
>>>
>>> TCB
>>>
>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>> Drive space isn't much of an issue, this would be mostly an office/travel
>>>> laptop, my music laptop is already tricked out with a 250GB drive. Also
>>> SSD
>>>> drives are just way to expensive now.
>>>>
>>>> I'll keep an eye on this. If they don't have any of the usual dying
batteries/cracking
>>>> cases problems that a lot of first gen Apple hardware has I'll give
one
>>> a
>>>> serious look.
>>>>
>>>> TCB
>>>>
>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>> TCB wrote:
>>>>&g
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Re: Snow [message #93025 is a reply to message #92995] |
Sat, 24 November 2007 22:26 |
|
|
(or 64GB if you want to spring for the solid state
>drive
>>>>>> option). If that's enough space to add Debial and XP, bootcamp should
>>>
>>>>>> support 'em. Or use one of the virtual machine setups if you want
to
>
>>>>>> switch between OSs on the fly. CPU is 1.8GHZ I think. Slower than
the
>>>
>>
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Re: Snow [message #93039 is a reply to message #93036] |
Sun, 25 November 2007 12:35 |
Neil
Messages: 1645
Registered: April 2006
|
Senior Member |
|
|
able.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
>>>>>>>>>>> The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive.
A
>>bit
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right now
I
>>need
>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>> heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie rentals,
>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>> wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for) yet.
Dang!
>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>>>>> guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now and NAB,
>>>>much
>>>>>>>>>>> like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice or
>fanfare.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and chipset
>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>>> more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch
>>>track
>>>>>>>>>>> pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>TCB wrote:
> Jamie,
>
> There's plenty of room for FW and ethernet, and those should not be considered
> luxury items. They're necessities on any computer these days. Why apple didn't
> include them is beyond me.
It looks to me like the design philosophy was "do everything you can to
make it thinner." Clearly they wanted the bragging rights of having "The
Worlds Thinnest Notebook" as they currently trumpet on their web site.
It's a faster subnotebook than Sony's, too, and less expensive
apparently. So in that market, this little beauty should make a splash.
To get there, the battery is not user-removable (like iPods). There are
minimal i/o ports. No expansion port. The CPU is a special sized-reduced
model from Intel. Etc.
However, I just read that you CAN get ethernet from Apple via a USB to
ethernet adapter for like $30. If that helps.
In the end it's just another choice. When evaluating the available Apple
laptop options, it's apparent that the regular MacBook is very
comparable to the Air. The regular Macbook is almost identical in
features with only slightly more weight, but with all the i/o ports, a
faster CPU, user replacable battery, user replaceable hard drive, and
lower cost. If I were you, assuming that the Air is sufficient for your
needs except for the missing i/o, I'd get a MacBook.
The MacBook Pro is also pretty much the same thing but with an expansion
port, faster graphics, and higher res screen choices. If I were me, and
I am, I'd get that. :^) Primarily to cover the video/graphics/animation
stuff I do - the audio stuff would be fine on a regular MacBook.
Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com
> TCB
>
> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>> Yeah, it's a lightened sub-notebook. No room for all that stuff. Great
>> for the market they're aiming it at, presumably. But not what I need
>> right now.
>>
>> However the Air's optional external USB optical drive is interesting to
>
>> me. Maybe I could take the internal DVDR out of my next MacBook Pro
>> laptop and put in a second hard drive, that would be useful. And use the
>
>> external DVDR that was just announced today for few times I'd need it
>> with the laptop. Hmm.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> -Jamie
>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>
>>
>>
>> James McCloskey wrote:
>>> And they left out FireWire. WTF are they thinking??? But hey it's thin
> enough
>>> to slice bread. What a joke!
>>>
>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>> Never mind, I take it all back, it doesn't have ethernet. Nice job Apple,
>>>> leave out a ten cent part on an $1800 laptop so I can't use it in my
> office
>>>> to talk to my servers securely over a wire.
>>>>
>>>> TCB
>>>>
>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>> Drive space isn't much of an issue, this would be mostly an office/travel
>>>>> laptop, my music laptop is already tricked out with a 250GB drive. Also
>>>> SSD
>>>>> drives are just way to expensive now.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'll keep an eye on this. If they don't have any of the usual dying
> batteries/cracking
>>>>> cases problems that a lot of first gen Apple hardware has I'll give
> one
>>>> a
>>>>> serious look.
>>>>>
>>>>> TCB
>>>>>
>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>> TCB wrote:
>>>>>>> I'm looking for a new portable, and saw the hype on this. If I can
> put
>>>>> Debian
>>>>>>> and XP on it I'd be sincerely interested, as long as the hardware
> specs
>>>>> aren't
>>>>>>> too horrible and they don't have massive hardware issues out of the
>>> chute.
>>>>>> HD is only 80GB (or 64GB if you want to spring for the solid state
> drive
>>>>>> option). If that's enough space to add Debial and XP, bootcamp should
>>>>>> support 'em. Or use one of the virtual machine setups if you want to
>
>>>>>> switch between OSs on the fly. CPU is 1.8GHZ I think. Slower than the
>>>>>> bigger/heavier laptops but still very capable.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
>>>>>>>> The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive. A bit
>>>>>>>> slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right now I need
>>>> a
>>>>>>>> heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie rentals,
>>>> a
>>>>>>>> wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for) yet. Dang!
>>> I
>>>>>>>> guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now and NAB,
> much
>>>>>>>> like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice or fanfare.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and chipset
>>> for
>>>>>>>> more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch track
>>>>>>>> pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>I've disagreed with Bill before. Including in this very thread. He was
gracious about it.
Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com
DC wrote:
> "Tom" <not@chance.com> wrote:
>> Problem is, you can't disagree with a Scientologist in
>> public without their death squads hunting you down, so this is
>> the only reason i am posting anonymously, which is probably at
>> least part of the reason NO ONE has ever disagreed with him on
>> this forum, ever.
>
> Bollocks.
>
> I've disagreed with Bill about Scientology, and more than once.
>
> He handles it well.
>
> DC
>I don't buy the form factor argument. It's not thinner than an ethernet jack,
and a mini FW plug is smaller the USB, which it has.
What if your wireless drivers break? How do you get the right drivers on
the machine? What happens if the card itself breaks, no networking possible?
And while WAP may be finally getting at least decent, what if you need to
transfer medical records, talk to a server, and so on? Wireless just isn't
as secure as a wire.
TCB
"Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>
>I'm guessing they think it's needed in order to keep the size down
>and keep the wow factor up (my daughter in 3rd year and her friends are
>dying to get it), whilst still providing alternatives for
>connect-ability so it's not a deal killer for users like us.
>
>Also, by doing so, they are driving the market (wireless) and therefore
have
>a leg up
>on the competition by establishing tech standards. I believe they were the
>first
>to drop floppy drives, use Firewire etc.
>
>Not saying I agree with their thinking, just speculating as to their rationale,
>FWIW.
>
>Ted
>
>
>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>
>>My point is that it shouldn't be necessary. Ethernet and at least one fw
>port
>>should be standard on any computer at this point. I have no clue why they
>>chose to exclude it.
>>
>>TCB
>>
>>"Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>Sorry - it's $29, plus the cost of a hub if you need other inputs simultaneously.
>>>
>>>
>>>"Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>Here's a USB2 to Ethernet adaptor that Apple is supplying for $20.
>>>>
>>>> http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObjects/AppleStore. woa/wa/RSLID?nplm=MB442Z/A#overview
>>>>
>>>>I'm sure there are USB to Firewire adaptors available too.
>>>>
>>>>Adding adaptors is second best I guess...
>>>>
>>>>Ted
>>>>
>>>>"TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>Jamie,
>>>>>
>>>>>There's plenty of room for FW and ethernet, and those should not be
considered
>>>>>luxury items. They're necessities on any computer these days. Why apple
>>>>didn't
>>>>>include them is beyond me.
>>>>>
>>>>>TCB
>>>>>
>>>>>Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Yeah, it's a lightened sub-notebook. No room for all that stuff. Great
>>>>
>>>>>>for the market they're aiming it at, presumably. But not what I need
>>
>>>>>>right now.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>However the Air's optional external USB optical drive is interesting
>>to
>>>>>
>>>>>>me. Maybe I could take the internal DVDR out of my next MacBook Pro
>
>>>>>>laptop and put in a second hard drive, that would be useful. And use
>>the
>>>>>
>>>>>>external DVDR that was just announced today for few times I'd need
it
>>>
>>>>>>with the laptop. Hmm.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Cheers,
>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>James McCloskey wrote:
>>>>>>> And they left out FireWire. WTF are they thinking??? But hey it's
>>>thin
>>>>>enough
>>>>>>> to slice bread. What a joke!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Never mind, I take it all back, it doesn't have ethernet. Nice job
>>>Apple,
>>>>>>>> leave out a ten cent part on an $1800 laptop so I can't use it in
>>my
>>>>>office
>>>>>>>> to talk to my servers securely over a wire.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Drive space isn't much of an issue, this would be mostly an office/travel
>>>>>>>>> laptop, my music laptop is already tricked out with a 250GB drive.
>>>>Also
>>>>>>>> SSD
>>>>>>>>> drives are just way to expensive now.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I'll keep an eye on this. If they don't have any of the usual dying
>>>>>batteries/cracking
>>>>>>>>> cases problems that a lot of first gen Apple hardware has I'll
give
>>>>>one
>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>> serious look.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> TCB wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> I'm looking for a new portable, and saw the hype on this. If
I
>>can
>>>>>put
>>>>>>>>> Debian
>>>>>>>>>>> and XP on it I'd be sincerely interested, as long as the hardware
>>>>>specs
>>>>>>>>> aren't
>>>>>>>>>>> too horrible and they don't have massive hardware issues out
of
>>>the
>>>>>>> chute.
>>>>>>>>>> HD is only 80GB (or 64GB if you want to spring for the solid state
>>>>>drive
>>>>>>>>>> option). If that's enough space to add Debial and XP, bootcamp
>should
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> support 'em. Or use one of the virtual machine setups if you want
>>>>to
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> switch between OSs on the fly. CPU is 1.8GHZ I think. Slower than
>>>>the
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> bigger/heavier laptops but still very capable.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
>>>>>>>>>>>> The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive.
>A
>>>bit
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right now
>I
>>>need
>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>> heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie rentals,
>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>> wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for) yet.
>Dang!
>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>>>>>> guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now and
NAB,
>>>>>much
>>>>>>>>>>>> like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice or
>>fanfare.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and chipset
>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>>>> more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch
>>>>track
>>>>>>>>>>>> pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>TCB wrote:
> I don't buy the form factor argument. It's not thinner than an ethernet jack,
> and a mini FW plug is smaller the USB, which it has.
I agree it would be better to have those ports. Although mini FW doesn't
supply power so that would leave some accessories in the cold.
But it looks like they were very strict in the design phase to leave off
anything they could in the interest of ultimate low weight and thinness.
> What if your wireless drivers break? How do you get the right drivers on
> the machine?
The external USB DVDR drive is a $100 option.
> What happens if the card itself breaks, no networking possible?
The USB to ethernet adapter is $30.
> And while WAP may be finally getting at least decent, what if you need to
> transfer medical records, talk to a server, and so on? Wireless just isn't
> as secure as a wire.
True.
Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com
> TCB
>
> "Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>> I'm guessing they think it's needed in order to keep the size down
>> and keep the wow factor up (my daughter in 3rd year and her friends are
>> dying to get it), whilst still providing alternatives for
>> connect-ability so it's not a deal killer for users like us.
>>
>> Also, by doing so, they are driving the market (wireless) and therefore
> have
>> a leg up
>> on the competition by establishing tech standards. I believe they were the
>> first
>> to drop floppy drives, use Firewire etc.
>>
>> Not saying I agree with their thinking, just speculating as to their rationale,
>> FWIW.
>>
>> Ted
>>
>>
>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>> My point is that it shouldn't be necessary. Ethernet and at least one fw
>> port
>>> should be standard on any computer at this point. I have no clue why they
>>> chose to exclude it.
>>>
>>> TCB
>>>
>>> "Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>>>> Sorry - it's $29, plus the cost of a hub if you need other inputs simultaneously.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>>>>> Here's a USB2 to Ethernet adaptor that Apple is supplying for $20.
>>>>>
>>>>> http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObjects/AppleStore. woa/wa/RSLID?nplm=MB442Z/A#overview
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm sure there are USB to Firewire adaptors available too.
>>>>>
>>>>> Adding adaptors is second best I guess...
>>>>>
>>>>> Ted
>>>>>
>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Jamie,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There's plenty of room for FW and ethernet, and those should not be
> considered
>>>>>> luxury items. They're necessities on any computer these days. Why apple
>>>>> didn't
>>>>>> include them is beyond me.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> Yeah, it's a lightened sub-notebook. No room for all that stuff. Great
>>>>>>> for the market they're aiming it at, presumably. But not what I need
>>>>>>> right now.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> However the Air's optional external USB optical drive is interesting
>>> to
>>>>>>> me. Maybe I could take the internal DVDR out of my next MacBook Pro
>>>>>>> laptop and put in a second hard drive, that would be useful. And use
>>> the
>>>>>>> external DVDR that was just announced today for few times I'd need
> it
>>>>>>> with the laptop. Hmm.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> James McCloskey wrote:
>>>>>>>> And they left out FireWire. WTF are they thinking??? But hey it's
>>>> thin
>>>>>> enough
>>>>>>>> to slice bread. What a joke!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Never mind, I take it all back, it doesn't have ethernet. Nice job
>>>> Apple,
>>>>>>>>> leave out a ten cent part on an $1800 laptop so I can't use it in
>>> my
>>>>>> office
>>>>>>>>> to talk to my servers securely over a wire.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Drive space isn't much of an issue, this would be mostly an office/travel
>>>>>>>>>> laptop, my music laptop is already tricked out with a 250GB drive.
>>>>> Also
>>>>>>>>> SSD
>>>>>>>>>> drives are just way to expensive now.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I'll keep an eye on this. If they don't have any of the usual dying
>>>>>> batteries/cracking
>>>>>>>>>> cases problems that a lot of first gen Apple hardware has I'll
> give
>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>> serious look.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> TCB wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm looking for a new portable, and saw the hype on this. If
> I
>>> can
>>>>>> put
>>>>>>>>>> Debian
>>>>>>>>>>>> and XP on it I'd be sincerely interested, as long as the hardware
>>>>>> specs
>>>>>>>>>> aren't
>>>>>>>>>>>> too horrible and they don't have massive hardware issues out
> of
>>>> the
>>>>>>>> chute.
>>>>>>>>>>> HD is only 80GB (or 64GB if you want to spring for the solid state
>>>>>> drive
>>>>>>>>>>> option). If that's enough space to add Debial and XP, bootcamp
>> should
>>>>>>>>>>> support 'em. Or use one of the virtual machine setups if you want
>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>> switch between OSs on the fly. CPU is 1.8GHZ I think. Slower than
>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>> bigger/heavier laptops but still very capable.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>> The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive.
>> A
>>>> bit
>>>>>>>>>>>>> slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right now
>> I
>>>> need
>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>>> heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie rentals,
>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>>> wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for) yet.
>> Dang!
>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>>>>>>> guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now and
> NAB,
>>>>>> much
>>>>>>>>>>>>> like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice or
>>> fanfare.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and chipset
>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>>>>> more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch
>>>>> track
>>>>>>>>>>>>> pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>You're missing my point. Let's say I have a user in Bangalore who just blew
out their wireless drivers. I can say, 'Go to the business center (or plug
in in your room) and call me on your cell phone.' I can walk them through
fixing their machine. WIth this Mac I'd have to say, 'Go buy a USB pen drive
and borrow someone's laptop that works and call me on your cell phone.' Busy
people traveling don't want to hear that.
I know I think like a tech, so I'm not really on Apple's wavelength, but
to me not having a secondary networking option is fundamentally bad computer
design. It's asking for trouble.
TCB
Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>TCB wrote:
>> I don't buy the form factor argument. It's not thinner than an ethernet
jack,
>> and a mini FW plug is smaller the USB, which it has.
>
>I agree it would be better to have those ports. Although mini FW doesn't
>supply power so that would leave some accessories in the cold.
>
>But it looks like they were very strict in the design phase to leave off
>anything they could in the interest of ultimate low weight and thinness.
>
>
>> What if your wireless drivers break? How do you get the right drivers
on
>> the machine?
>
>The external USB DVDR drive is a $100 option.
>
>
>> What happens if the card itself breaks, no networking possible?
>
>The USB to ethernet adapter is $30.
>
>
>> And while WAP may be finally getting at least decent, what if you need
to
>> transfer medical records, talk to a server, and so on? Wireless just isn't
>> as secure as a wire.
>
>True.
>
>Cheers,
> -Jamie
> www.JamieKrutz.com
>
>
>
>> TCB
>>
>> "Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>>> I'm guessing they think it's needed in order to keep the size down
>>> and keep the wow factor up (my daughter in 3rd year and her friends are
>>> dying to get it), whilst still providing alternatives for
>>> connect-ability so it's not a deal killer for users like us.
>>>
>>> Also, by doing so, they are driving the market (wireless) and therefore
>> have
>>> a leg up
>>> on the competition by establishing tech standards. I believe they were
the
>>> first
>>> to drop floppy drives, use Firewire etc.
>>>
>>> Not saying I agree with their thinking, just speculating as to their
rationale,
>>> FWIW.
>>>
>>> Ted
>>>
>>>
>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>> My point is that it shouldn't be necessary. Ethernet and at least one
fw
>>> port
>>>> should be standard on any computer at this point. I have no clue why
they
>>>> chose to exclude it.
>>>>
>>>> TCB
>>>>
>>>> "Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>>>>> Sorry - it's $29, plus the cost of a hub if you need other inputs simultaneously.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Here's a USB2 to Ethernet adaptor that Apple is supplying for $20.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObjects/AppleStore. woa/wa/RSLID?nplm=MB442Z/A#overview
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm sure there are USB to Firewire adaptors available too.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Adding adaptors is second best I guess...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ted
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> Jamie,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> There's plenty of room for FW and ethernet, and those should not
be
>> considered
>>>>>>> luxury items. They're necessities on any computer these days. Why
apple
>>>>>> didn't
>>>>>>> include them is beyond me.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Yeah, it's a lightened sub-notebook. No room for all that stuff.
Great
>>>>>>>> for the market they're aiming it at, presumably. But not what I
need
>>>>>>>> right now.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> However the Air's optional external USB optical drive is interesting
>>>> to
>>>>>>>> me. Maybe I could take the internal DVDR out of my next MacBook
Pro
>>>>>>>> laptop and put in a second hard drive, that would be useful. And
use
>>>> the
>>>>>>>> external DVDR that was just announced today for few times I'd need
>> it
>>>>>>>> with the laptop. Hmm.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> James McCloskey wrote:
>>>>>>>>> And they left out FireWire. WTF are they thinking??? But hey
it's
>>>>> thin
>>>>>>> enough
>>>>>>>>> to slice bread. What a joke!
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Never mind, I take it all back, it doesn't have ethernet. Nice
job
>>>>> Apple,
>>>>>>>>>> leave out a ten cent part on an $1800 laptop so I can't use it
in
>>>> my
>>>>>>> office
>>>>>>>>>> to talk to my servers securely over a wire.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> Drive space isn't much of an issue, this would be mostly an office/travel
>>>>>>>>>>> laptop, my music laptop is already tricked out with a 250GB drive.
>>>>>> Also
>>>>>>>>>> SSD
>>>>>>>>>>> drives are just way to expensive now.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I'll keep an eye on this. If they don't have any of the usual
dying
>>>>>>> batteries/cracking
>>>>>>>>>>> cases problems that a lot of first gen Apple hardware has I'll
>> give
>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>> serious look.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> TCB wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm looking for a new portable, and saw the hype on this. If
>> I
>>>> can
>>>>>>> put
>>>>>>>>>>> Debian
>>>>>>>>>>>>> and XP on it I'd be sincerely interested, as long as the hardware
>>>>>>> specs
>>>>>>>>>>> aren't
>>>>>>>>>>>>> too horrible and they don't have massive hardware issues out
>> of
>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> chute.
>>>>>>>>>>>> HD is only 80GB (or 64GB if you want to spring for the solid
state
>>>>>>> drive
>>>>>>>>>>>> option). If that's enough space to add Debial and XP, bootcamp
>>> should
>>>>>>>>>>>> support 'em. Or use one of the virtual machine setups if you
want
>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>> switch between OSs on the fly. CPU is 1.8GHZ I think. Slower
than
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>> bigger/heavier laptops but still very capable.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive.
>>> A
>>>>> bit
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right now
>>> I
>>>>> need
>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie
rentals,
>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for) yet.
>>> Dang!
>>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now and
>> NAB,
>>>>>>> much
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice
or
>>>> fanfare.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and
chipset
>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch
>>>>>> track
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>TCB wrote:
> You're missing my point. Let's say I have a user in Bangalore who just blew
> out their wireless drivers. I can say, 'Go to the business center (or plug
> in in your room) and call me on your cell phone.' I can walk them through
> fixing their machine. WIth this Mac I'd have to say, 'Go buy a USB pen drive
> and borrow someone's laptop that works and call me on your cell phone.' Busy
> people traveling don't want to hear that.
I thought you were talking about buying a laptop for yourself.
If you're speccing a machine for someone else that you support, and you
think there's a possibility the airport capability might fail, you'd
have to include the USB ethernet adapter.
> I know I think like a tech, so I'm not really on Apple's wavelength, but
> to me not having a secondary networking option is fundamentally bad computer
> design. It's asking for trouble.
It has a secondary networking option: that pesky USB to ethernet adapter.
Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com
> TCB
>
> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>> TCB wrote:
>>> I don't buy the form factor argument. It's not thinner than an ethernet
> jack,
>>> and a mini FW plug is smaller the USB, which it has.
>> I agree it would be better to have those ports. Although mini FW doesn't
>
>> supply power so that would leave some accessories in the cold.
>>
>> But it looks like they were very strict in the design phase to leave off
>
>> anything they could in the interest of ultimate low weight and thinness.
>>
>>
>>> What if your wireless drivers break? How do you get the right drivers
> on
>>> the machine?
>> The external USB DVDR drive is a $100 option.
>>
>>
>>> What happens if the card itself breaks, no networking possible?
>> The USB to ethernet adapter is $30.
>>
>>
>>> And while WAP may be finally getting at least decent, what if you need
> to
>>> transfer medical records, talk to a server, and so on? Wireless just isn't
>>> as secure as a wire.
>> True.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> -Jamie
>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>
>>
>>
>>> TCB
>>>
>>> "Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>>>> I'm guessing they think it's needed in order to keep the size down
>>>> and keep the wow factor up (my daughter in 3rd year and her friends are
>>>> dying to get it), whilst still providing alternatives for
>>>> connect-ability so it's not a deal killer for users like us.
>>>>
>>>> Also, by doing so, they are driving the market (wireless) and therefore
>>> have
>>>> a leg up
>>>> on the competition by establishing tech standards. I believe they were
> the
>>>> first
>>>> to drop floppy drives, use Firewire etc.
>>>>
>>>> Not saying I agree with their thinking, just speculating as to their
> rationale,
>>>> FWIW.
>>>>
>>>> Ted
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>> My point is that it shouldn't be necessary. Ethernet and at least one
> fw
>>>> port
>>>>> should be standard on any computer at this point. I have no clue why
> they
>>>>> chose to exclude it.
>>>>>
>>>>> TCB
>>>>>
>>>>> "Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Sorry - it's $29, plus the cost of a hub if you need other inputs simultaneously.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> Here's a USB2 to Ethernet adaptor that Apple is supplying for $20.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObjects/AppleStore. woa/wa/RSLID?nplm=MB442Z/A#overview
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'm sure there are USB to Firewire adaptors available too.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Adding adaptors is second best I guess...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ted
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Jamie,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> There's plenty of room for FW and ethernet, and those should not
> be
>>> considered
>>>>>>>> luxury items. They're necessities on any computer these days. Why
> apple
>>>>>>> didn't
>>>>>>>> include them is beyond me.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Yeah, it's a lightened sub-notebook. No room for all that stuff.
> Great
>>>>>>>>> for the market they're aiming it at, presumably. But not what I
> need
>>>>>>>>> right now.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> However the Air's optional external USB optical drive is interesting
>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>> me. Maybe I could take the internal DVDR out of my next MacBook
> Pro
>>>>>>>>> laptop and put in a second hard drive, that would be useful. And
> use
>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> external DVDR that was just announced today for few times I'd need
>>> it
>>>>>>>>> with the laptop. Hmm.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> James McCloskey wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> And they left out FireWire. WTF are they thinking??? But hey
> it's
>>>>>> thin
>>>>>>>> enough
>>>>>>>>>> to slice bread. What a joke!
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> Never mind, I take it all back, it doesn't have ethernet. Nice
> job
>>>>>> Apple,
>>>>>>>>>>> leave out a ten cent part on an $1800 laptop so I can't use it
> in
>>>>> my
>>>>>>>> office
>>>>>>>>>>> to talk to my servers securely over a wire.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> Drive space isn't much of an issue, this would be mostly an office/travel
>>>>>>>>>>>> laptop, my music laptop is already tricked out with a 250GB drive.
>>>>>>> Also
>>>>>>>>>>> SSD
>>>>>>>>>>>> drives are just way to expensive now.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I'll keep an eye on this. If they don't have any of the usual
> dying
>>>>>>>> batteries/cracking
>>>>>>>>>>>> cases problems that a lot of first gen Apple hardware has I'll
>>> give
>>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>> serious look.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> TCB wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm looking for a new portable, and saw the hype on this. If
>>> I
>>>>> can
>>>>>>>> put
>>>>>>>>>>>> Debian
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and XP on it I'd be sincerely interested, as long as the hardware
>>>>>>>> specs
>>>>>>>>>>>> aren't
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> too horrible and they don't have massive hardware issues out
>>> of
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>> chute.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> HD is only 80GB (or 64GB if you want to spring for the solid
> state
>>>>>>>> drive
>>>>>>>>>>>>> option). If that's enough space to add Debial and XP, bootcamp
>>>> should
>>>>>>>>>>>>> support 'em. Or use one of the virtual machine setups if you
> want
>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>> switch between OSs on the fly. CPU is 1.8GHZ I think. Slower
> than
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> bigger/heavier laptops but still very capable.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive.
>>>> A
>>>>>> bit
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right now
>>>> I
>>>>>> need
>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie
> rentals,
>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for) yet.
>>>> Dang!
>>>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now and
>>> NAB,
>>>>>>>> much
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice
> or
>>>>> fanfare.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and
> chipset
>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch
>>>>>>> track
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>I'm saying it's a massive design flaw, whether I'm using it or anyone else.
TCB
Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>TCB wrote:
>> You're missing my point. Let's say I have a user in Bangalore who just
blew
>> out their wireless drivers. I can say, 'Go to the business center (or
plug
>> in in your room) and call me on your cell phone.' I can walk them through
>> fixing their machine. WIth this Mac I'd have to say, 'Go buy a USB pen
drive
>> and borrow someone's laptop that works and call me on your cell phone.'
Busy
>> people traveling don't want to hear that.
>
>I thought you were talking about buying a laptop for yourself.
>
>If you're speccing a machine for someone else that you support, and you
>think there's a possibility the airport capability might fail, you'd
>have to include the USB ethernet adapter.
>
>
>> I know I think like a tech, so I'm not really on Apple's wavelength, but
>> to me not having a secondary networking option is fundamentally bad computer
>> design. It's asking for trouble.
>
>It has a secondary networking option: that pesky USB to ethernet adapter.
>
>Cheers,
> -Jamie
> www.JamieKrutz.com
>
>
>
>> TCB
>>
>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>> TCB wrote:
>>>> I don't buy the form factor argument. It's not thinner than an ethernet
>> jack,
>>>> and a mini FW plug is smaller the USB, which it has.
>>> I agree it would be better to have those ports. Although mini FW doesn't
>>
>>> supply power so that would leave some accessories in the cold.
>>>
>>> But it looks like they were very strict in the design phase to leave
off
>>
>>> anything they could in the interest of ultimate low weight and thinness.
>>>
>>>
>>>> What if your wireless drivers break? How do you get the right drivers
>> on
>>>> the machine?
>>> The external USB DVDR drive is a $100 option.
>>>
>>>
>>>> What happens if the card itself breaks, no networking possible?
>>> The USB to ethernet adapter is $30.
>>>
>>>
>>>> And while WAP may be finally getting at least decent, what if you need
>> to
>>>> transfer medical records, talk to a server, and so on? Wireless just
isn't
>>>> as secure as a wire.
>>> True.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> -Jamie
>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> TCB
>>>>
>>>> "Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>>>>> I'm guessing they think it's needed in order to keep the size down
>>>>> and keep the wow factor up (my daughter in 3rd year and her friends
are
>>>>> dying to get it), whilst still providing alternatives for
>>>>> connect-ability so it's not a deal killer for users like us.
>>>>>
>>>>> Also, by doing so, they are driving the market (wireless) and therefore
>>>> have
>>>>> a leg up
>>>>> on the competition by establishing tech standards. I believe they were
>> the
>>>>> first
>>>>> to drop floppy drives, use Firewire etc.
>>>>>
>>>>> Not saying I agree with their thinking, just speculating as to their
>> rationale,
>>>>> FWIW.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ted
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>> My point is that it shouldn't be necessary. Ethernet and at least
one
>> fw
>>>>> port
>>>>>> should be standard on any computer at this point. I have no clue why
>> they
>>>>>> chose to exclude it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> Sorry - it's $29, plus the cost of a hub if you need other inputs
simultaneously.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Here's a USB2 to Ethernet adaptor that Apple is supplying for $20.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObjects/AppleStore. woa/wa/RSLID?nplm=MB442Z/A#overview
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I'm sure there are USB to Firewire adaptors available too.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Adding adaptors is second best I guess...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Ted
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Jamie,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> There's plenty of room for FW and ethernet, and those should not
>> be
>>>> considered
>>>>>>>>> luxury items. They're necessities on any computer these days. Why
>> apple
>>>>>>>> didn't
>>>>>>>>> include them is beyond me.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Yeah, it's a lightened sub-notebook. No room for all that stuff.
>> Great
>>>>>>>>>> for the market they're aiming it at, presumably. But not what
I
>> need
>>>>>>>>>> right now.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> However the Air's optional external USB optical drive is interesting
>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>> me. Maybe I could take the internal DVDR out of my next MacBook
>> Pro
>>>>>>>>>> laptop and put in a second hard drive, that would be useful. And
>> use
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>> external DVDR that was just announced today for few times I'd
need
>>>> it
>>>>>>>>>> with the laptop. Hmm.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> James McCloskey wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> And they left out FireWire. WTF are they thinking??? But hey
>> it's
>>>>>>> thin
>>>>>>>>> enough
>>>>>>>>>>> to slice bread. What a joke!
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> Never mind, I take it all back, it doesn't have ethernet. Nice
>> job
>>>>>>> Apple,
>>>>>>>>>>>> leave out a ten cent part on an $1800 laptop so I can't use
it
>> in
>>>>>> my
>>>>>>>>> office
>>>>>>>>>>>> to talk to my servers securely over a wire.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Drive space isn't much of an issue, this would be mostly an
office/travel
>>>>>>>>>>>>> laptop, my music laptop is already tricked out with a 250GB
drive.
>>>>>>>> Also
>>>>>>>>>>>> SSD
>>>>>>>>>>>>> drives are just way to expensive now.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'll keep an eye on this. If they don't have any of the usual
>> dying
>>>>>>>>> batteries/cracking
>>>>>>>>>>>>> cases problems that a lot of first gen Apple hardware has I'll
>>>> give
>>>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>>> serious look.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> TCB wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm looking for a new portable, and saw the hype on this.
If
>>>> I
>>>>>> can
>>>>>>>>> put
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Debian
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and XP on it I'd be sincerely interested, as long as the
hardware
>>>>>>>>> specs
>>>>>>>>>>>>> aren't
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> too horrible and they don't have massive hardware issues
out
>>>> of
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>> chute.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> HD is only 80GB (or 64GB if you want to spring for the solid
>> state
>>>>>>>>> drive
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> option). If that's enough space to add Debial and XP, bootcamp
>>>>> should
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> support 'em. Or use one of the virtual machine setups if you
>> want
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> switch between OSs on the fly. CPU is 1.8GHZ I think. Slower
>> than
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bigger/heavier laptops but still very capable.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive.
>>>>> A
>>>>>>> bit
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right
now
>>>>> I
>>>>>>> need
>>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie
>> rentals,
>>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for)
yet.
>>>>> Dang!
>>>>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now
and
>>>> NAB,
>>>>>>>>> much
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice
>> or
>>>>>> fanfare.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and
>> chipset
>>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch
>>>>>>>> track
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>MacBook air, wow! Yawn!
I'm with Thad, this was a dumb oversight on Apple's part. In May they will
do updates to the MacBook line, I just hope they don't discontinue the MacBook.
I cant see paying a $700.00 premium that is slower and can't do as much.
Also the memory is soldered in, 2GB is the max. Thinner and lighter is
great, but I need functionality. At $1099.00, the MacBook is a better deal.
Apple, give the people what they want!
Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>TCB wrote:
>> You're missing my point. Let's say I have a user in Bangalore who just
blew
>> out their wireless drivers. I can say, 'Go to the business center (or
plug
>> in in your room) and call me on your cell phone.' I can walk them through
>> fixing their machine. WIth this Mac I'd have to say, 'Go buy a USB pen
drive
>> and borrow someone's laptop that works and call me on your cell phone.'
Busy
>> people traveling don't want to hear that.
>
>I thought you were talking about buying a laptop for yourself.
>
>If you're speccing a machine for someone else that you support, and you
>think there's a possibility the airport capability might fail, you'd
>have to include the USB ethernet adapter.
>
>
>> I know I think like a tech, so I'm not really on Apple's wavelength, but
>> to me not having a secondary networking option is fundamentally bad computer
>> design. It's asking for trouble.
>
>It has a secondary networking option: that pesky USB to ethernet adapter.
>
>Cheers,
> -Jamie
> www.JamieKrutz.com
>
>
>
>> TCB
>>
>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>> TCB wrote:
>>>> I don't buy the form factor argument. It's not thinner than an ethernet
>> jack,
>>>> and a mini FW plug is smaller the USB, which it has.
>>> I agree it would be better to have those ports. Although mini FW doesn't
>>
>>> supply power so that would leave some accessories in the cold.
>>>
>>> But it looks like they were very strict in the design phase to leave
off
>>
>>> anything they could in the interest of ultimate low weight and thinness.
>>>
>>>
>>>> What if your wireless drivers break? How do you get the right drivers
>> on
>>>> the machine?
>>> The external USB DVDR drive is a $100 option.
>>>
>>>
>>>> What happens if the card itself breaks, no networking possible?
>>> The USB to ethernet adapter is $30.
>>>
>>>
>>>> And while WAP may be finally getting at least decent, what if you need
>> to
>>>> transfer medical records, talk to a server, and so on? Wireless just
isn't
>>>> as secure as a wire.
>>> True.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> -Jamie
>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> TCB
>>>>
>>>> "Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>>>>> I'm guessing they think it's needed in order to keep the size down
>>>>> and keep the wow factor up (my daughter in 3rd year and her friends
are
>>>>> dying to get it), whilst still providing alternatives for
>>>>> connect-ability so it's not a deal killer for users like us.
>>>>>
>>>>> Also, by doing so, they are driving the market (wireless) and therefore
>>>> have
>>>>> a leg up
>>>>> on the competition by establishing tech standards. I believe they were
>> the
>>>>> first
>>>>> to drop floppy drives, use Firewire etc.
>>>>>
>>>>> Not saying I agree with their thinking, just speculating as to their
>> rationale,
>>>>> FWIW.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ted
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>> My point is that it shouldn't be necessary. Ethernet and at least
one
>> fw
>>>>> port
>>>>>> should be standard on any computer at this point. I have no clue why
>> they
>>>>>> chose to exclude it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> Sorry - it's $29, plus the cost of a hub if you need other inputs
simultaneously.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Here's a USB2 to Ethernet adaptor that Apple is supplying for $20.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObjects/AppleStore. woa/wa/RSLID?nplm=MB442Z/A#overview
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I'm sure there are USB to Firewire adaptors available too.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Adding adaptors is second best I guess...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Ted
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Jamie,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> There's plenty of room for FW and ethernet, and those should not
>> be
>>>> considered
>>>>>>>>> luxury items. They're necessities on any computer these days. Why
>> apple
>>>>>>>> didn't
>>>>>>>>> include them is beyond me.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Yeah, it's a lightened sub-notebook. No room for all that stuff.
>> Great
>>>>>>>>>> for the market they're aiming it at, presumably. But not what
I
>> need
>>>>>>>>>> right now.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> However the Air's optional external USB optical drive is interesting
>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>> me. Maybe I could take the internal DVDR out of my next MacBook
>> Pro
>>>>>>>>>> laptop and put in a second hard drive, that would be useful. And
>> use
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>> external DVDR that was just announced today for few times I'd
need
>>>> it
>>>>>>>>>> with the laptop. Hmm.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> James McCloskey wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> And they left out FireWire. WTF are they thinking??? But hey
>> it's
>>>>>>> thin
>>>>>>>>> enough
>>>>>>>>>>> to slice bread. What a joke!
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> Never mind, I take it all back, it doesn't have ethernet. Nice
>> job
>>>>>>> Apple,
>>>>>>>>>>>> leave out a ten cent part on an $1800 laptop so I can't use
it
>> in
>>>>>> my
>>>>>>>>> office
>>>>>>>>>>>> to talk to my servers securely over a wire.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Drive space isn't much of an issue, this would be mostly an
office/travel
>>>>>>>>>>>>> laptop, my music laptop is already tricked out with a 250GB
drive.
>>>>>>>> Also
>>>>>>>>>>>> SSD
>>>>>>>>>>>>> drives are just way to expensive now.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'll keep an eye on this. If they don't have any of the usual
>> dying
>>>>>>>>> batteries/cracking
>>>>>>>>>>>>> cases problems that a lot of first gen Apple hardware has I'll
>>>> give
>>>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>>> serious look.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> TCB wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm looking for a new portable, and saw the hype on this.
If
>>>> I
>>>>>> can
>>>>>>>>> put
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Debian
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and XP on it I'd be sincerely interested, as long as the
hardware
>>>>>>>>> specs
>>>>>>>>>>>>> aren't
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> too horrible and they don't have massive hardware issues
out
>>>> of
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>> chute.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> HD is only 80GB (or 64GB if you want to spring for the solid
>> state
>>>>>>>>> drive
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> option). If that's enough space to add Debial and XP, bootcamp
>>>>> should
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> support 'em. Or use one of the virtual machine setups if you
>> want
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> switch between OSs on the fly. CPU is 1.8GHZ I think. Slower
>> than
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bigger/heavier laptops but still very capable.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive.
>>>>> A
>>>>>>> bit
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right
now
>>>>> I
>>>>>>> need
>>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie
>> rentals,
>>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for)
yet.
>>>>> Dang!
>>>>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now
and
>>>> NAB,
>>>>>>>>> much
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice
>> or
>>>>>> fanfare.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and
>> chipset
>>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch
>>>>>>>> track
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>Yep indeed, a massive design flaw. For you, me and everyone else.
Except for those who don't need built-in ethernet or firewire and can
live with USB-only (or USB adapted to ethernet). IOW, not you and me.
Apple is gambling that the market for such an aggressively size-reduced
laptop is there.
And anyway, they already make a laptop that does what I need - I'm just
waiting for a refresh to pick up a few desired features (and I hope it
doesn't take months). Apple probably already makes a laptop that does
what you need. So neither of us really need this new, super light one
that we're criticizing.
Strangely enough, though, others are buying the MacBook Air and are even
excited about it. Go figure. :^)
Cheers,
-Jamie
www.JamieKrutz.com
TCB wrote:
> I'm saying it's a massive design flaw, whether I'm using it or anyone else.
>
>
> TCB
>
> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>> TCB wrote:
>>> You're missing my point. Let's say I have a user in Bangalore who just
> blew
>>> out their wireless drivers. I can say, 'Go to the business center (or
> plug
>>> in in your room) and call me on your cell phone.' I can walk them through
>>> fixing their machine. WIth this Mac I'd have to say, 'Go buy a USB pen
> drive
>>> and borrow someone's laptop that works and call me on your cell phone.'
> Busy
>>> people traveling don't want to hear that.
>> I thought you were talking about buying a laptop for yourself.
>>
>> If you're speccing a machine for someone else that you support, and you
>
>> think there's a possibility the airport capability might fail, you'd
>> have to include the USB ethernet adapter.
>>
>>
>>> I know I think like a tech, so I'm not really on Apple's wavelength, but
>>> to me not having a secondary networking option is fundamentally bad computer
>>> design. It's asking for trouble.
>> It has a secondary networking option: that pesky USB to ethernet adapter.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> -Jamie
>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>
>>
>>
>>> TCB
>>>
>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>> TCB wrote:
>>>>> I don't buy the form factor argument. It's not thinner than an ethernet
>>> jack,
>>>>> and a mini FW plug is smaller the USB, which it has.
>>>> I agree it would be better to have those ports. Although mini FW doesn't
>>>> supply power so that would leave some accessories in the cold.
>>>>
>>>> But it looks like they were very strict in the design phase to leave
> off
>>>> anything they could in the interest of ultimate low weight and thinness.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> What if your wireless drivers break? How do you get the right drivers
>>> on
>>>>> the machine?
>>>> The external USB DVDR drive is a $100 option.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> What happens if the card itself breaks, no networking possible?
>>>> The USB to ethernet adapter is $30.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> And while WAP may be finally getting at least decent, what if you need
>>> to
>>>>> transfer medical records, talk to a server, and so on? Wireless just
> isn't
>>>>> as secure as a wire.
>>>> True.
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> -Jamie
>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> TCB
>>>>>
>>>>> "Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>>>>>> I'm guessing they think it's needed in order to keep the size down
>>>>>> and keep the wow factor up (my daughter in 3rd year and her friends
> are
>>>>>> dying to get it), whilst still providing alternatives for
>>>>>> connect-ability so it's not a deal killer for users like us.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Also, by doing so, they are driving the market (wireless) and therefore
>>>>> have
>>>>>> a leg up
>>>>>> on the competition by establishing tech standards. I believe they were
>>> the
>>>>>> first
>>>>>> to drop floppy drives, use Firewire etc.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Not saying I agree with their thinking, just speculating as to their
>>> rationale,
>>>>>> FWIW.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ted
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> My point is that it shouldn't be necessary. Ethernet and at least
> one
>>> fw
>>>>>> port
>>>>>>> should be standard on any computer at this point. I have no clue why
>>> they
>>>>>>> chose to exclude it.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Sorry - it's $29, plus the cost of a hub if you need other inputs
> simultaneously.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Here's a USB2 to Ethernet adaptor that Apple is supplying for $20.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObjects/AppleStore. woa/wa/RSLID?nplm=MB442Z/A#overview
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I'm sure there are USB to Firewire adaptors available too.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Adding adaptors is second best I guess...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Ted
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Jamie,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> There's plenty of room for FW and ethernet, and those should not
>>> be
>>>>> considered
>>>>>>>>>> luxury items. They're necessities on any computer these days. Why
>>> apple
>>>>>>>>> didn't
>>>>>>>>>> include them is beyond me.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> Yeah, it's a lightened sub-notebook. No room for all that stuff.
>>> Great
>>>>>>>>>>> for the market they're aiming it at, presumably. But not what
> I
>>> need
>>>>>>>>>>> right now.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> However the Air's optional external USB optical drive is interesting
>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>> me. Maybe I could take the internal DVDR out of my next MacBook
>>> Pro
>>>>>>>>>>> laptop and put in a second hard drive, that would be useful. And
>>> use
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>> external DVDR that was just announced today for few times I'd
> need
>>>>> it
>>>>>>>>>>> with the laptop. Hmm.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> James McCloskey wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> And they left out FireWire. WTF are they thinking??? But hey
>>> it's
>>>>>>>> thin
>>>>>>>>>> enough
>>>>>>>>>>>> to slice bread. What a joke!
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Never mind, I take it all back, it doesn't have ethernet. Nice
>>> job
>>>>>>>> Apple,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> leave out a ten cent part on an $1800 laptop so I can't use
> it
>>> in
>>>>>>> my
>>>>>>>>>> office
>>>>>>>>>>>>> to talk to my servers securely over a wire.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Drive space isn't much of an issue, this would be mostly an
> office/travel
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> laptop, my music laptop is already tricked out with a 250GB
> drive.
>>>>>>>>> Also
>>>>>>>>>>>>> SSD
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> drives are just way to expensive now.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'll keep an eye on this. If they don't have any of the usual
>>> dying
>>>>>>>>>> batteries/cracking
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cases problems that a lot of first gen Apple hardware has I'll
>>>>> give
>>>>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> serious look.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> TCB wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm looking for a new portable, and saw the hype on this.
> If
>>>>> I
>>>>>>> can
>>>>>>>>>> put
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Debian
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and XP on it I'd be sincerely interested, as long as the
> hardware
>>>>>>>>>> specs
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> aren't
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> too horrible and they don't have massive hardware issues
> out
>>>>> of
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>> chute.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> HD is only 80GB (or 64GB if you want to spring for the solid
>>> state
>>>>>>>>>> drive
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> option). If that's enough space to add Debial and XP, bootcamp
>>>>>> should
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> support 'em. Or use one of the virtual machine setups if you
>>> want
>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> switch between OSs on the fly. CPU is 1.8GHZ I think. Slower
>>> than
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bigger/heavier laptops but still very capable.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state drive.
>>>>>> A
>>>>>>>> bit
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right
> now
>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>> need
>>>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie
>>> rentals,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for)
> yet.
>>>>>> Dang!
>>>>>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now
> and
>>>>> NAB,
>>>>>>>>>> much
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice
>>> or
>>>>>>> fanfare.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU and
>>> chipset
>>>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch
>>>>>>>>> track
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>I could live with the Ethernet adapter, but no FW port? They unnecessarily
narrowed there market with that one. A lot of AV people would have bought
it. I'm sure they will come out with a FW version someday when sales sag.
Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>
>Yep indeed, a massive design flaw. For you, me and everyone else.
>
>Except for those who don't need built-in ethernet or firewire and can
>live with USB-only (or USB adapted to ethernet). IOW, not you and me.
>
>Apple is gambling that the market for such an aggressively size-reduced
>laptop is there.
>
>And anyway, they already make a laptop that does what I need - I'm just
>waiting for a refresh to pick up a few desired features (and I hope it
>doesn't take months). Apple probably already makes a laptop that does
>what you need. So neither of us really need this new, super light one
>that we're criticizing.
>
>Strangely enough, though, others are buying the MacBook Air and are even
>excited about it. Go figure. :^)
>
>Cheers,
> -Jamie
> www.JamieKrutz.com
>
>
>TCB wrote:
>> I'm saying it's a massive design flaw, whether I'm using it or anyone
else.
>>
>>
>> TCB
>>
>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>> TCB wrote:
>>>> You're missing my point. Let's say I have a user in Bangalore who just
>> blew
>>>> out their wireless drivers. I can say, 'Go to the business center (or
>> plug
>>>> in in your room) and call me on your cell phone.' I can walk them through
>>>> fixing their machine. WIth this Mac I'd have to say, 'Go buy a USB pen
>> drive
>>>> and borrow someone's laptop that works and call me on your cell phone.'
>> Busy
>>>> people traveling don't want to hear that.
>>> I thought you were talking about buying a laptop for yourself.
>>>
>>> If you're speccing a machine for someone else that you support, and you
>>
>>> think there's a possibility the airport capability might fail, you'd
>>> have to include the USB ethernet adapter.
>>>
>>>
>>>> I know I think like a tech, so I'm not really on Apple's wavelength,
but
>>>> to me not having a secondary networking option is fundamentally bad
computer
>>>> design. It's asking for trouble.
>>> It has a secondary networking option: that pesky USB to ethernet adapter.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> -Jamie
>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> TCB
>>>>
>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>> TCB wrote:
>>>>>> I don't buy the form factor argument. It's not thinner than an ethernet
>>>> jack,
>>>>>> and a mini FW plug is smaller the USB, which it has.
>>>>> I agree it would be better to have those ports. Although mini FW doesn't
>>>>> supply power so that would leave some accessories in the cold.
>>>>>
>>>>> But it looks like they were very strict in the design phase to leave
>> off
>>>>> anything they could in the interest of ultimate low weight and thinness.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> What if your wireless drivers break? How do you get the right drivers
>>>> on
>>>>>> the machine?
>>>>> The external USB DVDR drive is a $100 option.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> What happens if the card itself breaks, no networking possible?
>>>>> The USB to ethernet adapter is $30.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> And while WAP may be finally getting at least decent, what if you
need
>>>> to
>>>>>> transfer medical records, talk to a server, and so on? Wireless just
>> isn't
>>>>>> as secure as a wire.
>>>>> True.
>>>>>
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> I'm guessing they think it's needed in order to keep the size down
>>>>>>> and keep the wow factor up (my daughter in 3rd year and her friends
>> are
>>>>>>> dying to get it), whilst still providing alternatives for
>>>>>>> connect-ability so it's not a deal killer for users like us.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Also, by doing so, they are driving the market (wireless) and therefore
>>>>>> have
>>>>>>> a leg up
>>>>>>> on the competition by establishing tech standards. I believe they
were
>>>> the
>>>>>>> first
>>>>>>> to drop floppy drives, use Firewire etc.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Not saying I agree with their thinking, just speculating as to their
>>>> rationale,
>>>>>>> FWIW.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ted
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> My point is that it shouldn't be necessary. Ethernet and at least
>> one
>>>> fw
>>>>>>> port
>>>>>>>> should be standard on any computer at this point. I have no clue
why
>>>> they
>>>>>>>> chose to exclude it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> "Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Sorry - it's $29, plus the cost of a hub if you need other inputs
>> simultaneously.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Here's a USB2 to Ethernet adaptor that Apple is supplying for
$20.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObjects/AppleStore. woa/wa/RSLID?nplm=MB442Z/A#overview
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I'm sure there are USB to Firewire adaptors available too.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Adding adaptors is second best I guess...
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Ted
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> Jamie,
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> There's plenty of room for FW and ethernet, and those should
not
>>>> be
>>>>>> considered
>>>>>>>>>>> luxury items. They're necessities on any computer these days.
Why
>>>> apple
>>>>>>>>>> didn't
>>>>>>>>>>> include them is beyond me.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> Yeah, it's a lightened sub-notebook. No room for all that stuff.
>>>> Great
>>>>>>>>>>>> for the market they're aiming it at, presumably. But not what
>> I
>>>> need
>>>>>>>>>>>> right now.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> However the Air's optional external USB optical drive is interesting
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>> me. Maybe I could take the internal DVDR out of my next MacBook
>>>> Pro
>>>>>>>>>>>> laptop and put in a second hard drive, that would be useful.
And
>>>> use
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>> external DVDR that was just announced today for few times I'd
>> need
>>>>>> it
>>>>>>>>>>>> with the laptop. Hmm.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> James McCloskey wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> And they left out FireWire. WTF are they thinking??? But
hey
>>>> it's
>>>>>>>>> thin
>>>>>>>>>>> enough
>>>>>>>>>>>>> to slice bread. What a joke!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Never mind, I take it all back, it doesn't have ethernet.
Nice
>>>> job
>>>>>>>>> Apple,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> leave out a ten cent part on an $1800 laptop so I can't use
>> it
>>>> in
>>>>>>>> my
>>>>>>>>>>> office
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to talk to my servers securely over a wire.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> "TCB" <nobody@ishere.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Drive space isn't much of an issue, this would be mostly
an
>> office/travel
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> laptop, my music laptop is already tricked out with a 250GB
>> drive.
>>>>>>>>>> Also
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> SSD
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> drives are just way to expensive now.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'll keep an eye on this. If they don't have any of the usual
>>>> dying
>>>>>>>>>>> batteries/cracking
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cases problems that a lot of first gen Apple hardware has
I'll
>>>>>> give
>>>>>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> serious look.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> TCB wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm looking for a new portable, and saw the hype on this.
>> If
>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>> can
>>>>>>>>>>> put
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Debian
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and XP on it I'd be sincerely interested, as long as the
>> hardware
>>>>>>>>>>> specs
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> aren't
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> too horrible and they don't have massive hardware issues
>> out
>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> chute.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> HD is only 80GB (or 64GB if you want to spring for the solid
>>>> state
>>>>>>>>>>> drive
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> option). If that's enough space to add Debial and XP, bootcamp
>>>>>>> should
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> support 'em. Or use one of the virtual machine setups if
you
>>>> want
>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> switch between OSs on the fly. CPU is 1.8GHZ I think. Slower
>>>> than
>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bigger/heavier laptops but still very capable.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> TCB
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> New thin MacBook Air just announced. www.Apple.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The track pad is multitouch now. Optional solid state
drive.
>>>>>>> A
>>>>>>>>> bit
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> slower CPU than the other MacBooks but not bad.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It looks pretty cool for something that light. But right
>> now
>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>>> need
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> heavy lifter 17" HD res box, so it's not for me.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also at MacWorld: Software updates to iPhone/iTouch, movie
>>>> rentals,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wireless backup system, and an iTV update.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> No refresh for the other laptops (what I'm waiting for)
>> yet.
>>>>>>> Dang!
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> guess they'll sneak that update in sometime between now
>> and
>>>>>> NAB,
>>>>>>>>>>> much
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> like they did with the MacPro last week with little notice
>>>> or
>>>>>>>> fanfare.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm expecting LED backlighting on the 17", updated CPU
and
>>>> chipset
>>>>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> more speed and battery life, and now I'm expecting a multitouch
>>>>>>>>>> track
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> pad! Hope it doesn't take months...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -Jamie
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>We seem to be headed towards a wireless world, so Air isn't too far off of
that
mark. Probably find a niche with post gen-x business travelers that live on
wifi and
thumb drives.
Not the solution audio and video people would want, but like Jamie said,
we still have other laptops for that - just not ones thin enough to
accidentally
bend in half, or send with a fax... ;-)
Imho, connectivity needs a little update - perhaps a snap locked fiber port
with 10+ G/s speeds. 1394 is too loose of a connection design, and 1394c and
faster are no
where to be seen yet (not to mention that most laptops use the smaller
unpowered 1394 port).
USB is too slow to the be the defacto data port on laptops, even though it
is.
Fine for smaller or low bandwidth devices, but too slow for data backup of
any size.
My .02.
Dedric
"James McCloskey" <excelsm@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:478e7056$1@linux...
>
> MacBook air, wow! Yawn!
>
> I'm with Thad, this was a dumb oversight on Apple's part. In May they
> will
> do updates to the MacBook line, I just hope they don't discontinue the
> MacBook.
> I cant see paying a $700.00 premium that is slower and can't do as much.
> Also the memory is soldered in, 2GB is the max. Thinner and lighter is
> great, but I need functionality. At $1099.00, the MacBook is a better
> deal.
>
> Apple, give the people what they want!
>
> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>TCB wrote:
>>> You're missing my point. Let's say I have a user in Bangalore who just
> blew
>>> out their wireless drivers. I can say, 'Go to the business center (or
> plug
>>> in in your room) and call me on your cell phone.' I can walk them
>>> through
>>> fixing their machine. WIth this Mac I'd have to say, 'Go buy a USB pen
> drive
>>> and borrow someone's laptop that works and call me on your cell phone.'
> Busy
>>> people traveling don't want to hear that.
>>
>>I thought you were talking about buying a laptop for yourself.
>>
>>If you're speccing a machine for someone else that you support, and you
>
>>think there's a possibility the airport capability might fail, you'd
>>have to include the USB ethernet adapter.
>>
>>
>>> I know I think like a tech, so I'm not really on Apple's wavelength, but
>>> to me not having a secondary networking option is fundamentally bad
>>> computer
>>> design. It's asking for trouble.
>>
>>It has a secondary networking option: that pesky USB to ethernet adapter.
>>
>>Cheers,
>> -Jamie
>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>
>>
>>
>>> TCB
>>>
>>> Jamie K <Meta@Dimensional.com> wrote:
>>>> TCB wrote:
>>>>> I don't buy the form factor argument. It's not thinner than an
>>>>> ethernet
>>> jack,
>>>>> and a mini FW plug is smaller the USB, which it has.
>>>> I agree it would be better to have those ports. Although mini FW
>>>> doesn't
>>>
>>>> supply power so that would leave some accessories in the cold.
>>>>
>>>> But it looks like they were very strict in the design phase to leave
> off
>>>
>>>> anything they could in the interest of ultimate low weight and
>>>> thinness.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> What if your wireless drivers break? How do you get the right drivers
>>> on
>>>>> the machine?
>>>> The external USB DVDR drive is a $100 option.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> What happens if the card itself breaks, no networking possible?
>>>> The USB to ethernet adapter is $30.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> And while WAP may be finally getting at least decent, what if you need
>>> to
>>>>> transfer medical records, talk to a server, and so on? Wireless just
> isn't
>>>>> as secure as a wire.
>>>> True.
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> -Jamie
>>>> www.JamieKrutz.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> TCB
>>>>>
>>>>> "Ted Gerber" <tedgerber@rogers.com> wrote:
>>>>>> I'm guessing they think it's needed in order to keep the size down
>>>>>> and keep the wow factor up (my daughter in 3rd year and her friends
> are
>>>>>> dying to get it), whilst still providing alternatives for
>>>>>>
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